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  #1  
Old 27-11-2007, 05:44 PM
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Old Devices, New Firmwares, Contract Phones.......ONE BIG QUESTION! *IMPORTANT*

Ok, so N-Gage as a platform is "soon to be here" and we all want to be ready and there is one BIG Question buzzing around in my head atm, but first abit of info.

The Background:

just recently a N95 firmware was released v20, however this ONLY works if you have an unbranded NOKIA phone (i.e. paid the original 450 (or 350 as it is now) for the phone and not had it on contract. Not only that ive heard that N93 and N73 may be getting possible firmware updates in the future (which isn't a problem for me since my N73 and N93 are unbranded phones).

all these new FIRMWARE updates inlcudes the N-GAGE PREVIEW APP (which is the same preview app shipped with N81 (and 8GB) and N95 8GB).

The Question:

Will the new N-GAGE Games and N-GAGE APPLICATION work on existing N95's, N73's and N93's WITHOUT the latest firmware update? - as the people who are on contract like me and hox only have V12 (me) and v11 (Hoax). as our phones are branded and we never know when they wlill release the next firmware update.

so if the N-Gage App / Game /Support doesn't work due to lack of the latest firmware then we are screwed basically. As Hoax has been waiting AGES for Orange UK to provide an Orange Branded V12 N95 Firmware.

Other Option:

The only othe option of getting the latest firmware on our contract phones is buy using a program called NSS - all i know is that it changes the code of the phone (to what you want) so it makes it possible to update, but then u have to do a MASTER REFORMAT after installing the update and then change it back to the original Phone Code, which is kinda complicated and a long job for updating phone.

So any comments would be fine on the situation (if the n-gage games work with the latest firmware thats fine, but ive read the specs sheet on the firmware and it says "N-GAGE GAMES SUPPORT" which means to me, that for the games to work on the N95 you need that firmware.

  #2  
Old 27-11-2007, 06:03 PM
Tomo71 Tomo71 is offline
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There are plenty of threads on here about de-branding your phone. It is very very very simple. It takes about 15 minutes to update the software on the phone through Nokia Suite. Compare that to the 15 seconds it takes to change the product code.

If a new operator specific SW was released that would still mean the phone had to be backed up beforehand so de-branding has no drawback on that front.

Changing back the product code to the orginal is the same process. If the phone goes in from warranty people report that debranding does not affect this.

Steve
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  #3  
Old 27-11-2007, 06:27 PM
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The N-Gage client on its release in december will be a downloadable application, it is highly unlikely that you will need a firmware update to install, the current N-Gage client installed on the N95, N82, N81 etc etc is just a preview demo.
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  #4  
Old 27-11-2007, 06:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ratkat View Post
The N-Gage client on its release in december will be a downloadable application, it is highly unlikely that you will need a firmware update to install, the current N-Gage client installed on the N95, N82, N81 etc etc is just a preview demo.
But with an N95 you'll almost certainly not have enough RAM without demand paging (or they'll run really s l o w l y

  #5  
Old 27-11-2007, 06:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by davecozens View Post
But with an N95 you'll almost certainly not have enough RAM without demand paging (or they'll run really s l o w l y
Welcome to firmware V20, Demand Paging

Like Tomo says, its v v easy to upgrade and debrand your phone, all in all from plugging my usb cable in to changing product code to EURO1 then downloading new firmware and it installing, thne changing product code back, took all of a cigarette and to make a cup of coffee and put the bin out.

  #6  
Old 27-11-2007, 07:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Navs View Post
Welcome to firmware V20, Demand Paging

Like Tomo says, its v v easy to upgrade and debrand your phone, all in all from plugging my usb cable in to changing product code to EURO1 then downloading new firmware and it installing, thne changing product code back, took all of a cigarette and to make a cup of coffee and put the bin out.
No argument from me. I never even bothered changing the code back. T-Mobile UK almost never issue firmware updates. Had it since V12.

Havnig got the v20 fw last night I certainly recommend it to anyone. Performance is much betterer

  #7  
Old 29-11-2007, 09:15 PM
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well i would'nt mind changing the product code of my phone, but its only 2 months old and still in warranty, and apparently changing the product code of the phone voids your warranty and i do not wanna do that.

  #8  
Old 30-11-2007, 07:33 AM
bugmenot bugmenot is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tomo71 View Post
There are plenty of threads on here about de-branding your phone. It is very very very simple. It takes about 15 minutes to update the software on the phone through Nokia Suite. Compare that to the 15 seconds it takes to change the product code.

If a new operator specific SW was released that would still mean the phone had to be backed up beforehand so de-branding has no drawback on that front.

Changing back the product code to the orginal is the same process. If the phone goes in from warranty people report that debranding does not affect this.

Steve
"If the phone goes in from warranty people report that debranding does not affect this" what do u mean by this? Changing product code won't void warranty?

  #9  
Old 30-11-2007, 09:17 AM
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To clear up this warranty thing, these are the facts:

1) Changing your product code DOES invalidate your warranty BUT you can change it back right after upgrading if you want to and it is then impossible to prove you did it. Of course, having a phone with orange written on it and the non-branded firmware is something of a giveaway but in many cases the only physical branding is on the battery cover, so just buy a blank replacement!

2) In my experience the nokia service centers don't seem to care what product code you have. I have taken my T-Mobile N95 (with t-mobile logo on the back) to them twice now, and this is the results:
- First time I had v11 non-branded firmware but had changed the prod code back to the t-mobile one. It came back newly flashed with the t-mobile v11 (which had been released by that point).
-Second time I had debranded v12 on and had forgotten to change the product code back. Again it came back reflashed but this time with the same (debranded) v12 firmware.

Basically it seems they flash the phone as a matter of course when doing a repair but they will just put on whatever firmware NSU gives them. The only potential problem, therefore, is if you change the product code, upgrade, change the code back and then get it repaired before the branded version is available. In this case they would try to reflash and find that the latest version for your product code is lower than the version you have! Simple solution is to not bother changing the product code back, it doesn't seem to matter.

This may be different in different service centers. I am lucky because my local one is an independant retailer so they are just interested in fixing it and are top lads who know their sh*t. I imagine places like carphone warehouse are more anal and therefore more likely to look for reasons to charge you.

The risky way is to just debrand and leave it like I have. The less lazy but still technically illegal way is to change the product code AND remove any physical branding by replacing the battery cover (or any other marked case parts). The completely safe way is to leave the product code well alone and just hold out for the branded firmware.

Last edited by 3Shirts; 30-11-2007 at 09:23 AM.
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  #10  
Old 30-11-2007, 11:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 3Shirts View Post
To clear up this warranty thing, these are the facts:

1) Changing your product code DOES invalidate your warranty BUT you can change it back right after upgrading if you want to and it is then impossible to prove you did it. Of course, having a phone with orange written on it and the non-branded firmware is something of a giveaway but in many cases the only physical branding is on the battery cover, so just buy a blank replacement!

2) In my experience the nokia service centers don't seem to care what product code you have. I have taken my T-Mobile N95 (with t-mobile logo on the back) to them twice now, and this is the results:
- First time I had v11 non-branded firmware but had changed the prod code back to the t-mobile one. It came back newly flashed with the t-mobile v11 (which had been released by that point).
-Second time I had debranded v12 on and had forgotten to change the product code back. Again it came back reflashed but this time with the same (debranded) v12 firmware.

Basically it seems they flash the phone as a matter of course when doing a repair but they will just put on whatever firmware NSU gives them. The only potential problem, therefore, is if you change the product code, upgrade, change the code back and then get it repaired before the branded version is available. In this case they would try to reflash and find that the latest version for your product code is lower than the version you have! Simple solution is to not bother changing the product code back, it doesn't seem to matter.

This may be different in different service centers. I am lucky because my local one is an independant retailer so they are just interested in fixing it and are top lads who know their sh*t. I imagine places like carphone warehouse are more anal and therefore more likely to look for reasons to charge you.

The risky way is to just debrand and leave it like I have. The less lazy but still technically illegal way is to change the product code AND remove any physical branding by replacing the battery cover (or any other marked case parts). The completely safe way is to leave the product code well alone and just hold out for the branded firmware.
...and the smartest and not risky in any way way is to change your product code, install V20 firmware, if something is wrong, just change it back to the original code and send to repair.

I don't understand people being stuck with old firmware because of being afraid of consequences, when it's 5sec thing to change the code back?

  #11  
Old 30-11-2007, 11:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rottie View Post
...and the smartest and not risky in any way way is to change your product code, install V20 firmware, if something is wrong, just change it back to the original code and send to repair.

I don't understand people being stuck with old firmware because of being afraid of consequences, when it's 5sec thing to change the code back?
Well no, as I tried to explain, if you send your phone in with v20 firmware but it has the Orange (for example) product code and only v12 has been released on Orange, it's a giveaway that you changed the code at some point and your warranty may be up the spout. I agree this risk is very very small but worth mentioning.

  #12  
Old 30-11-2007, 12:32 PM
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Ok, if you'll send it with latest firmware. But after restoring the original code you can reflash to the latest OFFICIAL FW for your code, can't you?

  #13  
Old 30-11-2007, 12:41 PM
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No, you can't downgrade.

  #14  
Old 30-11-2007, 12:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rottie View Post
Ok, if you'll send it with latest firmware. But after restoring the original code you can reflash to the latest OFFICIAL FW for your code, can't you?
Only if the branded firmware for your produce code is up to the same version or higher. I've just upgraded to v20 but Orange hasn't even released v12 yet, so the chance of them ever catching up is very very slim...

  #15  
Old 30-11-2007, 12:45 PM
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Have you tried? What does the Nokia Software shows where normally you have current and latest firmware versions?

I wanted to try but my Nokia Software Updater stopped working! It takes ages to start, just to show that some crucial software is missing and it can't run. I repaired it and reinstalled completely twice already to no success!! What a crap! :(

Last edited by rottie; 30-11-2007 at 12:53 PM.
 

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