BOOOOOM ::: Nokmote beta 1 for Nokia N95 is here :P

any chance anyone could sign this for me? i have the email from samir confirming im a donateor and the unsigned app

Another point that people are forgetting is that this is Samir's software. It's up to him what he does with it. Heck, he could've just kept all the testing to himself, delay the release of the software even more, and then charge each of us £5 for it!

If that's the alternative, I'd rather keep it as it is tbh.

3Shirts wrote:Totally agree. It's one thing to crack software from big developers but one individual who spends his free time developing some of the best apps for the device needs all the support he can get not little pricks like riffina spreading it for free

It might be a big company but ultimately it is still theft and it still effects someones livelihood and income.

If you are prepared to rip off a large company and not a one man band then not only are you a thief but also a hypocrit.

zxon wrote:Another point that people are forgetting is that this is Samir's software. It's up to him what he does with it. Heck, he could've just kept all the testing to himself, delay the release of the software even more, and then charge each of us �5 for it!

He is ripping off his most loyal users and that isn't right.

Arny wrote:You know, that would be a better way to do it.

We would only be complaining about it if he did. 🙄

Question: How much does Samir ask us to donate?
Answer: He doesn't.

Even something as small as a euro, which is ~75p, is a donation. Only the tightest of the tight would notice that going missing.

zxon wrote:We would only be complaining about it if he did. 🙄

Question: How much does Samir ask us to donate?
Answer: He doesn't.

Even something as small as a euro, which is ~75p, is a donation. Only the tightest of the tight would notice that going missing.

Why can't you understand the concept? I would happily pay for some software AFTER purchase but not as a BETA TESTER!! SAMIR is using your feedback to make the programme better and who benefits.. you or me. I do of course.

Crazy, crazy concept. Just imagine you installed the programme and your phone stopped working. You paid him to do that LOL He amends programme and I win.

I get it 1 month later so what, mine works at YOUR EXPENSE LOL!!!

:icon13:

I've edited the post in question. As i donator myself for both the rotateme & nokmote apps & forum membership i feel it is only fair to respect the wishes of the author.

Samir has & always will make his apps freeware. all he asks is that if we would like to beta test his apps that we support him by making a donation, no matter how small. without this he would not be able to spend as much time developing the apps & correcting bugs.

Lordhawkwind wrote:Why can't you understand the concept? I would happily pay for some software AFTER purchase but not as a BETA TESTER!! SAMIR is using your feedback to make the programme better and who benefits.. you or me. I do of course.

Crazy, crazy concept. Just imagine you installed the programme and your phone stopped working. You paid him to do that LOL He amends programme and I win.

I get it 1 month later so what, mine works at YOUR EXPENSE LOL!!!

:icon13:

I agree, it is a strange concept.

I believe what Samir is asking for is that those who want to support him during the beta stages do so in two ways

1: financially
2: by providing feedback

it's not a bad idea & i'me sure this approach has led to accelerated development of both rotateme & nokmote.

GRIM REAPER wrote:I've edited the post in question. As i donator myself for both the rotateme & nokmote apps & forum membership i feel it is only fair to respect the wishes of the author.

Samir has & always will make his apps freeware. all he asks is that if we would like to beta test his apps that we support him by making a donation, no matter how small. without this he would not be able to spend as much time developing the apps & correcting bugs.

C'mon even Microsoft or Nvidia can't pull this trick off. Asking people to pay to be beta testers!

Way beyond my comprehension.

Hey Samir can you tell us why?

😉

Lordhawkwind wrote:C'mon even Microsoft or Nvidia can't pull this trick off. Asking people to pay to be beta testers!

Way beyond my comprehension.

Hey Samir can you tell us why?

😉

hahahahah thats where ur wrong!!! i had 2 pay microsoft �24 to test ther windows vista a few years ago!!!! so yes i could have downloades it from the net somwher but i did the right thing and bought the beta and left my feedback and problems with them!!

would u listen 2 any1 who says ur prog is shitt or would u prefen a list of ppl u know has the betaand since has paind a little something would apriciate it more and give u constructive critisism!

he has 2 make money sum how! its ethr charge a little for betas or add advertising and things 2 his progs!!

put yourself in his shoes!!!!

I'll admit I've never seen this being done before, making a donation to be a beta tester, but at the same time I've never actually donated towards software before. Previously I've either downloaded officially released freeware software or paid for it.

I can see the point of view that it's strange to pay to do someone else's job, in so many words. I understand that companies like Microsoft can give out beta's for free, as I'm signed up as a Microsoft beta tester myself and it hasn't cost me a penny so far (although I haven't beta tested anything as big as Vista yet). At the same time, we're not talking about a multi-national corporation here. We're talking about one man who has many other commitments in his life. One man who isn't earning a salary making these programs, who is asking for those out of the goodness of their hearts to help him where they can.

He can't ask for anyone to code a piece of the software with him as not everyone can program in C++, and we've proven on these very forums that many have difficulty even signing their own applications when others have found it so easy. I'm certainly not saying that these people are idiots, definately not. I bet friends of mine who have MSc degrees couldn't do it either.

However, one way that people CAN help is financially. If Samir was asking for much bigger donations like £5 or £10 off everyone and it resulted in unoriginal and appalling software then I can fully back up the opposing argument, but we all know that's not the case. We beta testers may have given money towards this cause, but I'm sure that I'm not alone in stating that we're proud to be a part of something that means so much to so many people.

Grim Reaper - thanks for removing the link to the app.

Lordhawkwind wrote:C'mon even Microsoft or Nvidia can't pull this trick off. Asking people to pay to be beta testers!

Way beyond my comprehension.

Hey Samir can you tell us why?

😉

This thread (and the people complaining about samir) is becoming rather irritating. It's really very simple.

If like me, you have no patience and want to play with samirs new toys now, before general release, send money.

If you have patience, wait and get it finished for free.

It's samirs product, samirs free time, samirs code and he's doing it his way. He certainly doesn't need to explain himself to you or anybody else. Deal with it.

davecozens wrote:This thread (and the people complaining about samir) is becoming rather irritating. It's really very simple.

If like me, you have no patience and want to play with samirs new toys now, before general release, send money.

If you have patience, wait and get it finished for free.

It's samirs product, samirs free time, samirs code and he's doing it his way. He certainly doesn't need to explain himself to you or anybody else. Deal with it.

If you had any sense you wouldn't encourage him and everyone would hold off until release. If he needs cash then he should charge everyone and give it free to the beta testers like everyone else. If he doesn't want to charge everyone then he should give something free to his beta testers (like early next release) not make them the only ones who have to pay for it. That is not right.

Yes, it is Samir's product, his free time, his code. No he doesn't need to explain himself and so you shouldn't need to explain it on his behalf either.

I don't agree with the concept of charging for beta testing... it is just ripping off his most loyal people. DEAL WITH IT!

*gets handbag out*

Cmon now - lets calm down a bit eh? lol

Wookie-HTID wrote:*gets handbag out*

Cmon now - lets calm down a bit eh? lol

I have to say though that some people just will not allow others to have their own opinions on the forum.

OK, I disagree with charging for beta testing... others don't. We should all be allowed our own opinions shouldn't we?

Yes, disagree if you want to but don't get personal, or angry or try to stop others voicing their view regardless of how much you disagree... I am entitled to my own views and you to yours.

If you are fed up hearing other peoples views and can't cope with disagreeing with them - GO SOMEWHERE ELSE! This is what a forum is all about - discussing and by definition that means differences of option.

Get used to it or go somewhere that accepts personal insults... easy.

i think you will find this started when some idiot posted a link to his software and not the fact that people have diffrent views.

i cant see what the fuss is about here, you donate because you support what he is doing and appreciate the time and effort that he is putting into these projects, not to get free betas, thats just a plus side of having donated is that he lets you in on the testing phase. he's clever enough to make the apps, im sure he's clever enough to fix bugs with a closed beta testing circle of friends.if you dont want to donate, dont donate its simple as that, you will still find a leak of every beta he produces by just googling it.if he's making some money off it then good on him, if he's making a hell of a lot of money off it then even better on him for having good ideas and the ability to see them through to apps that we all use and enjoy. no one is twisting your arms to donate.get a grip.

The problem is that you can disagree with Samir's software distribution strategy 'till the cows come home, but that doesn't give you the rights to subvert it. He doesn't owe anyone anything - even if he never releases his final free version, it would just make his software effectively 'donationware' (it doesn't have a set donation price), and if you're not happy with that, you don't have to pay and you don't have to use it.

The 'I dislike the license, therefore I'll steal it' view does rather annoy me; some people say that Windows or Office or Photoshop is too expensive, so it's justified to use a cracked version. But this isn't like stealing bread to feed your starving family - you can live without these programs quite fine if you disapprove of their prices. Maybe you don't like the free alternatives (Linux, OpenOffice.org, the GIMP etc.) as much, or they have fewer features, but you can't have it both ways.

I waited to post when the offending link was removed - no free 'bump' for this sort of thing 😉

People should respect the programmers wishes - especially when its one guy in his bedroom and not a big company! If people do this sort of thing it will result in a closed beta or products which arent freeware.

If the beta is out for free, no one will donate - and then maybe he will need to charge for the final product???

i say good on him and keep up the good work. ill certainly keep donating as i enjoy his work.i hope he makes loads of cash out of the likes of me as he has tallent and this could be his brake.

So how much did the loss turn out to be for the dudette?

Mithent wrote:The problem is that you can disagree with Samir's software distribution strategy 'till the cows come home, but that doesn't give you the rights to subvert it.

I don't support doing anything illegal or wrong. In fact I support Samir's right to do what he is doing even though I am not in agreement with WHAT he is doing. I am absolutely dead against theft in any way. He has set out his stall and having done that then to get hold of his software prior to public release without donating is wrong. The link should not have been posted and I am glad it has been removed.

haha samir is a symbian celebrity.

Samir's strategy is quite simple..

1: make the application donationware for willing beta testers to help keep him running during development, thus enabling him to devote more time to the development process.

2: make the end product freeware so that everyone can enjoy it & also to make it's potential growth limitless.

i'm sure there wouldn't be as many users of his programs if we all had to pay for the final versions.

GRIM REAPER wrote:Samir's strategy is quite simple..

1: make the application donationware for willing beta testers to help keep him running during development, thus enabling him to devote more time to the development process.

2: make the end product freeware so that everyone can enjoy it & also to make it's potential growth limitless.

i'm sure there wouldn't be as many users of his programs if we all had to pay for the final versions.

Sorry but his site says it's freeware and always will be LOL!

IMHO anyone paying to be a beta tester is a n00b. No offence but a silly idea.
If it screws your phone you paid for it do that LOL!! Samir says tough it was a beta release so tough luck!

Just droped by to give my 2c.

All this talk about paying for beta. I never "payed" for the beta. I donated to Samir for his work. For that I got beta version. Do I have to test it? No. If I do, I then also have a chance to make the the software more to my liking. As for him "ripping" me off because I donated and he gave me his work inprogress and then he will release it for free, 😮. Its like a kid complaining that he had to do some chores for his candy and another kid got his without work. Samir gives his supporters what he is working on and people jump his throat. Almost would be better for him to just keep it for close friends.

EDIT: changed the kid analogy

Donation - "A donation is a gift given, typically to a cause or/and for charitable purposes."

Payment - "A payment is the transfer of wealth from one party (such as a person or company) to another. A payment is usually made in exchange for the provision of goods, services, or both, or to fulfill a legal obligation."

Fact of the matter is that we donate because we want to support Samir. As pointed out previously, getting a beta is just a benefit of donating. Have you seen anyone else producing apps like RotateMe and NokMote for S60 devices? I think not.

Source: Wikipedia

I agree with macrossru. You aren't 'paying' for the beta, you are donating to the project. Hundreds of developers ask for donations to help support them, its perfectly normal. What Samir is doing is to say thank you to donators by sending them the in progress betas. People seem to be looking at this as if you are buying the beta but that's simply not how this works.

It's been said countless times but if you want to donate then you can also play with the betas, if you don't then just wait for the final release.
I agree with Mithent too. This topic came about when someone posted the link as they disagreed with donating for the beta. Regardless of how you feel about the way Samir distributes, subverting it is still wrong. I think going 80 on the motorway is usually fine, doesn't mean I can just do it and ignore the law.

Paying and donating are two different things I agree, but not in this case.

When you pay for a product, you knowingly expect your financial commitment to be requited by the product you are after. When you make a donation for a worthwhile cause, you give away an asset/belonging unconditionally, not expecting anything back in return. Your contribution is not enticed by any incentive, condition or circumstance, but given entirely because you believe that your effort will better the cause. You are genuinely sweet-hearted, compassionate for the world around you, willing to sacrifice a little dosh to make the world a better place to live in. 😊

Why did a few members calling BOOHOO when Samir asked for "donation"? Let me give you my 2 cents.

When you entice people with wordings like ......

(Take note of the second sentence. I'm sure you can't miss it, because it's bolded in RED.)

you are indirectly selling your product, because you are giving an incentive in exchange for those who does a "good deed", a "worldly cause", or whatever you wanna call it by DONATING to you. Of course, every word is structured politely and elegantly, but the meaning is clear, so let's not deny this is the meaning in essence:-

Pay me, and in return I will make sure you get all the beta releases.

Nothing is wrong with the way he does it. I would have done the same. 😉 Plenty of charitable organizations do things like that all the time - entice people to donate and in return they organize lucky draws that give away apartments, cars etc to the winners.

See, to me it's fine to give Samir money. But morally, I will not consider it as a donation, because many donors donate because their gestures are driven by the beta releases. Contribution via enticement is NOT a donation, which is an holistic contribution with no expectation for any form of requitement.

If these donors are genuinely concern for Samir's cause and not because of the betas, how come people fuss about not getting the betas/emails from Samir on time? Here's a thread:-

http://www.allaboutsymbian.com/forum//forum/thread/68193/&highlight=Samir

Well, to me Samir is not wrong to ask for contribution politely, which is why he phrased his intention the way it is. Those of you who have donated, know what to expect from your contribution. To illustrate this, in that thread above, a member posted:-

Well, he's darn right he paid for that! His annoyance is understandable. At least he's honest :icon14:. Let's see if there will be as many donors if Samir is not releasing any betas to them? 🙄 Of course there will be! The current donors are genuinely sweet-hearted, compassionate for the world around them, willing to sacrifice a little dosh to make the world a better place to live in. 😊

So what am I trying to convey? Donors can call their contribution as whatever they want - "donation", "financial aid", "charity" etc. But to me and many clear-hearted minds out there, it's all hypocritical. So what's wrong if you say you paid for the betas? Or even say you bought it? I don't see anything wrong with that? I'll probably have a laugh at you, :reddy: you around a lil bit, and hey that's about it.:biggrin:

Smart lad that Samir bloke. :biggrin:

Lordhawkwind wrote:Sorry but his site says it's freeware and always will be LOL!

IMHO anyone paying to be a beta tester is a n00b. No offence but a silly idea.
If it screws your phone you paid for it do that LOL!! Samir says tough it was a beta release so tough luck!

Technically speaking his application can't screw up your phone, it has it's own SID and UID, the whole caged directory thing prevents 'bad stuff TM' from happening. The most damage it could do is to hang or reboot your phone and delete a few files from public directories.

That said, I otherwise concur with the general thrust of your message, though I would probably tone it down a tad - I would not personally donate money for what are essentially simple applications that are nothing more than the linking of existing and documented API's to perform some very basic and equally well documented functions.

What would be really handy is screen rotation in all four directions. I'd actually pay for that. What bugs me is the headphone jack, don't know who's brilliant idea it was to stick that on the side, though I'd very much like to smack my phone upside his head for it. Some days I want to use GPS on my cars dashboard, and listen to music at the same time, all with sane orientation.