In a move that should be regarded as sound business sense from one of the largest companies in the world, Google will be closing the Jaiku and Dodgeball services in the near future. While I don't want to dwell on those specific cases (although both have been sidelined by the Mountain View company since they were purchased), it's an interesting warning signal for those of us who wish to live in the clouds and rely on hosted web services.
Read on in the full article.
I haven't read anything that Jaiku is closing. The article says "changes for Jaiku", but there was nothing about the site going down.
Jaiku is going open source
I don't quite understand the logic of Google buying Jaiku, and then closing it down just over a year later. Were they just throwing cash around at random?
More on the Jaiku blog:
http://www.jaiku.com/blog/2009/01/15/were-going-open-source/
It seems Google won't be supporting it directly any more, but it will continue "thanks to a dedicated and passionate volunteer team of Googlers".
This is why there is a strong business opportunity for easier to install and manage apps in the cloud *that are hosted by the user in their own webspace*. Most webhosts offer PHP and MySQL support for example. It would be fairly painless to make installation of an app onto this space as easy as it is for an end user to install Firefox, or OpenOffice for example, on their desktop. This could be installed on �5/mth (or less) shared web hosting, not having to bear much of a load as only one or two users will use it. Redundancy could quite easily be achieved by installing across 2 separate web hosting accounts that communicate with each other automatically (e.g. via FTP). This is not rocket science (I write web apps so I know!). It should be easy to move data between installs on different web hosts if one went bust for example (assuming the software was written to make it easy, and this can already be easy - 1 click zip and download of a data directory then 1 click upload and install to another machine (for example mysqladmin is techy software but it has this feature for a mysql database). The software could still be a commercial product that generates income for it's creators - it does not have to be open source. There are good PHP obfuscators and packagers for example.
This is a market success waiting to happen...
Alex
phonething.com
Oh please, cloud computing services aren't going anywhere. There's a clear logical fallacy going on here, and it reveals the level to which you guys cling to Symbian's/Nokia's rapidly diminishing foothold in a changing market. Pointing out the demise of two very small cloud based services does not demonstrate that cloud-based computing is going anywhere. Sure, things will be realigned and corrected, but you guys need to get real about the future, as does your main sponsor. Symbian and Nokia are so Web 1.0 it's hilarious. And All About Symbian, right down to the way the site is designed and presented, is bobbing around in a funny, anachronistic little Web 1.0 pond, too.
Unregistered, why do you even visit this site if you're going to write long paragraphs of non-constructive abuse?
You don't like Symbian, you don't like Nokia, you don't like AAS... what the heck are you doing here?
You (I'm guessing it's you as it's happened a lot lately) also still keep repeating this lie that we're sponsored by Nokia. We aren't.
If you stopped telling lies maybe people might take you more seriously.
Unregistered wrote:Oh please, cloud computing services aren't going anywhere. There's a clear logical fallacy going on here, and it reveals the level to which you guys cling to Symbian's/Nokia's rapidly diminishing foothold in a changing market. Pointing out the demise of two very small cloud based services does not demonstrate that cloud-based computing is going anywhere. Sure, things will be realigned and corrected, but you guys need to get real about the future, as does your main sponsor. Symbian and Nokia are so Web 1.0 it's hilarious. And All About Symbian, right down to the way the site is designed and presented, is bobbing around in a funny, anachronistic little Web 1.0 pond, too.
Where did the author say cloud computing services were going away?
A specific service being "[...] realigned and corrected [...]" is precisely the issue. *Any* service from *any* company can disappear. What is so wrong about prudently making a local backup of important data?
By the way, "so Web 1.0" ... who talks like that?
So now you're telling me that All About Symbian isn't a schill for Nokia/Symbian? When I watch the "Phones" show, what do I see? This site looks like something designed in a 1995 HTML class, which is what Symbian looks like, too.
@unregistered: "When I watch the Phones show, what do I see? This site looks like something designed in a 1995 HTML class" - Ah yes, I learned how to program in HTML around 1995. Nothing to feel guilty about though, HTML rocks, always has done. My Phones Show web site exists *only* to host the embedded videos and as such it doesn't need fancy CSS, sidebars, forums, adverts, widgets, comments and all the other frippery of the modern age....
I meant, when I watch the phones show, I see a big opening animation that says sponsored by "Symbian".
But the HTML stuff is true, too.
My overall point here, which I'd like to make before I'm booted out of here as a Troll, is that in my view AAS doesn't challenge the platform to move forward, it doesn't question Symbian's moribund level of innovation. It just sort of lumbers alongside Symbian's decline.
That's why your piece about the dangers of cloud computing (which aren't really dangers at all if you'd cared to research the way user data will be handled) are the height of irony.
The danger isn't cloud computing, it's the Symbian universe's failure to embrace cloud computing more fully. And don't try to tell me Ovi is some kind of savior. It's too little, too late.
I know I may have rankled some people, perhaps unnecessarily, but for AAS to write a piece about the dangers of cloud computing just struck me as highly ironic. Give me cloud computing any day over taking my phone into some store to get the firmware updated, or downloading all my data to some fiddly Windows-only app so I can update my internet radio player (as in the latest e71 update).
Come on you guys, you should be putting the challenge to Symbian and Nokia. Not running poorly-researched pieces about the dangers of cloud computing.
I apologize for saying your site looks like it came from my 1995 HTML class. It's more like 1996, I admit.
So now you're telling me that All About Symbian isn't a schill for Nokia/Symbian?
Yes.
We are an independent site, we have no connection to Nokia or Symbian.
Now please stop making false accusations.
The reason we only cover Symbian is because it's a niche site, it's the place people go to for info about Symbian hardware and software. We've covered all manufacturers with Symbian devices, and we cover all providers of Symbian applications.
I meant, when I watch the phones show, I see a big opening animation that says sponsored by "Symbian".
Well, you see, this is why it's worth getting your facts straight before you start making accusations about other people.
Yes, the Phones Show is sponsored by Symbian, but the Phones Show is nothing to do with AAS.
Steve, who does the Phones Show, is a freelance journalist who writes Symbian articles for AAS, iPhone articles for All About iPhone, covers all smartphone formats for PDA Essentials magazine, and covers all smartphone formats for Phones Show. He also has his own personal website covering various topics, which I assume is the one you refer to, and again is nothing to do with AAS.
The irony is that if you actually watch the Phones Show you'll see it's full of coverage and praise for non-Symbian devices, because sponsorship isn't the same thing as ownership. Games sites might be sponsored by (for example) Electronic Arts but that doesn't make them an extension of EA's marketing department.
, but for AAS to write a piece about the dangers of cloud computing just struck me as highly ironic.
Ironic in what sense?
Give me cloud computing any day over taking my phone into some store to get the firmware updated
Erm... the latest Symbian devices all have OTA firmware updates. Is that "cloud" enough for you?
And as you yourself point out in the same rant you can also update through a Windows PC, that's been the case for many years now.
Come on you guys, you should be putting the challenge to Symbian and Nokia. Not running poorly-researched pieces about the dangers of cloud computing.
(sigh) Do you actually READ our articles? Actually read them instead of just skimming the intros or conclusions?
I'll tell you what is ironic, you criticising our research and then failing to do your own research properly. It's like you've partially read one article and decided it represents the whole site.
I'm on the N-Gage section of this site and write plenty of criticism when I feel it is appropriate:
http://www.allaboutngage.com/features/item/N-Gage_shoots_itself_in_the_foot.php
http://www.allaboutngage.com/features/item/Are_online_rankings_N-Gage_Arenas_worst_enemy.php
http://www.allaboutngage.com/features/item/When_will_N-Gage_really_launch.php
http://www.allaboutngage.com/features/item/Where_the_heck_are_all_the_phones.php
...and we even managed to get Nokia lots and lots and lots of bad publicity when they refused to allow game transfers, something very widely reported by mainstream media such as the BBC:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/7414323.stm
...but I suppose in your conspiracy theory logic this is all some "deep cover" means to fool people into thinking we're independent.
My overall point here, which I'd like to make before I'm booted out of here as a Troll,
You might look less like a troll if you'd:
1) Use some kind of name, either registered or unregistered
2) Actually make specific points instead of telling people to "wake up"
3) Be polite instead of making personal attacks
4) Stop telling lies
...is that in my view AAS doesn't challenge the platform to move forward, it doesn't question Symbian's moribund level of innovation. It just sort of lumbers alongside Symbian's decline.
Could you give a link to an AAS article where we DON'T make some kind of criticism? I bet you can't. 😊
Your view is rather undermined by your total lack of evidence that you even read the article you were discussing, or that you read this site in general.
If you made some SPECIFIC points, actually quoted bits of articles you disagreed with, we could have a proper discussion. But instead you just make vague accusations without really saying what you're talking about.
We DO question things all the time, and if you read our articles you'd know that, so I can only assume you don't read them.
And think Symbian is moribund because...? Or are you going to say "it just is"?
See that's the problem, you don't give reasons, you just state opinions and expect everyone to agree with you.
You're not ready to hear what I'm saying. Moving on...
You're not ready to hear what I'm saying. Moving on...
You're not saying anything though, just hurling abuse.
If you think something's wrong with Symbian, say what it is exactly, then we can talk about it. 😊
Otherwise it's like children saying "you smell!" "no, you smell!"...
Waayy to go Tzer2..Dear Unregistered, If You Got Nothing Nice To Say, then Just Shut The F*ck Up! Nobody gives a s*it bout what you think.
Unregistered wrote:Nobody gives a s*it bout what you think.
Uh, if I look at the quite lengthy posts that Tzer2 wrote in attempts to refute this "Unregistered" I think this is not quite true at the moment.
But I agree, one probably should just ignore Unregistered. Provoking lengthy posts arguing with him (or her) is fun, being ignored completely is not. Guess which way will stop Unregistered sooner. "Don't feed the trolls."
As to the clouds and their dangers, the subject of the article: I think they are very true, and I for one understood an important fact about them only recently. Bringing up a service and make it work more or less is rather easy nowadays, but to make it something that people really can depend on is much more difficult, and most existing services probably have a *looong* way to go to reach that level.
In the extreme, think about all that "friends" and "yearbook" craze: A traditional, physical yearbook is something you can go through 30 years after leaving school, at your first class reunion. Which "service" will still be around 30 years from now to allow you to do likewise?
Unregistered wrote:........And All About Symbian, right down to the way the site is designed and presented, is bobbing around in a funny, anachronistic little Web 1.0 pond, too.......
AAS eds, please ignore this guy. Your site is just fine the way it is.
Call me a dinosaur, but my idea of a website is lots of content, displayed inline as much as possible, with clickable links that take me to other parts of the website. If I want to access the same exact page/resource at a later point of time (say from a bookmark), I should be able to go directly to it. And content is king. That way, you are a pretty decent website in my book.
When one of my clients want a "web 2.0" ui, I don't bother to counter them, provided it doesn't contradict the functionality that they really require. I just give them what they ask for. But personally, I prefer to view gmail/yahoo/hot mail in plain html mode.
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"on topic", this is the reason why I don't use google docs too much. I am not worried if google docs is going away any time soon, but I am not comfortable with my documents and information being kept with a third party. I had taken a serious look at google docs when I was trying to move away from MS Office. And I still use it occasionally for the online sharing features. But it is primarily OpenOffice for me.
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And in the same vein, whatever happened to Ovi sync? These days I get an "invalid host name" error whenever I try to sync. It started around the same time that they recently declared a big upgrade .
Thanks for the various comments. And yes probably should ignore trolls, but its not always that easy! And, being even-handed, its all feedback, but honestly I'd rather people sent it to me direct (via the contact form) and kept comment threads on topic.
I would point out the website design etc. is my responsibility, but I have very deliberately chosen to focus on content. We do have various plans for new stuff this year which inevitably some people will like and some people wont.
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On topics:
Cloud services etc have their space, but clearly its not a either or solution. For a lot of people its going to be more conevnient to store things locally for cost / security reasons just as for some the cloud works for convenience peace of mind. Personally the hybrid services work best for me.
Sorry if it seemed like I was feeding a troll, I did try to keep my initial reply short, but it's frustrating to see this person repeatedly accuse us of being some sort of propaganda site. We aren't, we're independent, we have no connection to any company. If you read any of our articles you see criticism and praise alongside each other, which is what an independent site should contain.
We aren't secretly paid by Nokia or anyone else, we get our money from the advertisers that you see next to the articles. Occasionally some of them might be banners for Nokia or Symbian, but they're more often for someone else (for example right now the AAS banners on my screen are advertising Samsung, Google Chrome and Fleasome.com). If you want to know where AAS's money comes from, look at the adverts on AAS.
AAS is lent phones by Nokia, Samsung and other Symbian hardware manufacturers, but they have to go back after a 2 week period (or even shorter if they're prototypes). Sometimes manfacturers, including Nokia, won't even lend us certain phones, which means we have to buy those devices ourselves just to review them.
We're spending money to create these reviews, we don't charge any subscription fees, all we get is the advertising money, which makes it even more annoying to hear someone repeatedly accuse the site of being in the manufacturers' pay.
Slightly on topic: Does anyone know what is up with ovi today? It's down all morning, so either they must have had a serious crash or they are implementing some new stuff. Thankfully I also have my data on the mobile, which is one more argument to rely on both - your own data and the one in the cloud...