while riding my bike i always have stupid ideas, here's the new idea...
please see this as an basic idea - i know how to program in different languages - not C - so not for the 7650, but i made some conclusions to get to this idea....
Developers - is this possible...?
Companys... this could be the most wanted feature.... big $$ 😉
Users - could this be the most wanted feature...?
ok, here we go, call me stupid but what if there is a app that simply implements the missing bluetooth audio profile...?
most of us know the mit answering machine... technically it receives calls, handels the audio, puts it in a soundfile, plays soundfiles to the caller,...
so the part of audio <-> gsm should be possible
on the other side the program could use the bluetooth functions to implement the bluetooth-audio profile... and forward the voice-samples between thos to parts... gsm and bluetooth.
what i don't know, and i guess that's the problem, otherwise we would have this app since months.... i guess the bluetooth has to be programmed on a low level - not using a high-level api, but interface the chipset directly....? and that could be very hard to accomplish, and depending on the architecture of the OS it could be impossible without modding the kernel? (just thinking about kernel and user mode when it comes to unixes...)
so first of all.... what do the devs think...? is it a new idea... or did you all think about this years ago and find out this is impossible...?
2nd... users...? who would need this...? would be the killer app for me.
3rd - where are the companies doing it...? 😊)
I think that it will be some lag caused by the encode/decode. even 10-20ms of lag can create communication problems. but maybe it is doable, who knows...
And by the way you forgot sth very critical(and so did i). The 7650's bluetooth cannot send voice only data... What i had in mind was sth else. A program that will encode the voice to data and send it to a special bluetooth handsfree that will have the ability to decode the data to voice... But again we need special hardware...
All this has been done already. The hardware part that is.
Plantronics M1500 Headset
http://www.plantronics.com/north_america/en_US/catalog/display_category_type.jhtml?rootId=cat1150057&id=cat1220039&productTypeId=cat1220039
and Jabra
http://www.jabra.com/products/FreeSpeak_nonBluetooth.htm
Plantronics is not available outside US. Jabra can be bought from
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3018585458&category=15040
Just be sure to specify that you need the 2.5 plug for Nokia phones
[quote="Doc"]All this has been done already. The hardware part that is.
Plantronics M1500 Headset
http://www.plantronics.com/north_america/en_US/catalog/display_category_type.jhtml?rootId=cat1150057&id=cat1220039&productTypeId=cat1220039
and Jabra
http://www.jabra.com/products/FreeSpeak_nonBluetooth.htm
Plantronics is not available outside US. Jabra can be bought from
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3018585458&category=15040
Just be sure to specify that you need the 2.5 plug for Nokia phones[/quote]
I didn;t mean exactly that.
The whole coding in my opinion should be done by the 7650 cpu and then transmited as DATA to the bluetooth hansfree and be decoded from DATA to VOICE. The above solutions you've mentioned need an extra piece of hardware connected on 7650's hands free port. In other words they add an extra bluetooth device to make the job...
ok, the delay part is a good thing... a good argument, actually it could be a bad thing... :/
another bad thing could be the battery usage... i guess it's the point that some stuff has to be made by software instead of hardware as this seems to be missing (btw, thanks nokia developers, never said that and i think it's time to 😉 )... this would cost cpu cycles and therefore more battery... but actually i don't care if i have to charge it once or twice a day, it's already worse 😉
and i forgot to say that i know about the workarounds that are available - hook a bluetooth box to the phone using a cable... no matter if plantronics or jabra....
not a bad idea, imho it's crap because.. 2nd device you need to plug to the phone that needs huge space already by itself.... the 7650 nearly doesn't fit in pockets.... now put another 'huge' device on it...? *lol*
another device with batteries that can get empty, get used out,.... *lol*
about coding the voice to data... well... the voice already _is_ data as it comes digitally... but i didn't think about sending it over a bluetooth data-connection.... so this won't work with any headset on the market...
you wrote the phone is only cabable of sending bluetooth data... yes. that's the problem.
and why not resolve this problem with a program that access the chipset directly, bypass the kernel/apis and implement _real_ bluetooth_audio, standard-conforming...?
that is the idea i have in mind.... if this would work... killer app... buy the 7650, buy the app, load it and *tada* there is a working bluetooth audio support for headsets on the market.... can't be that bad....
so to keep it on track... we have:
- cpu-usage / delay of voice data / battery usage
- possibility to use a api (some low-raw level api maybe?) or bypass the apis to get the bluetooth audio-profile implemented
my problem is that i have no idea where to find the last point out... is there any no-go fact or could it be possible in theorie.... if yes, did some people already try this - or who want's to try it...? i just have ideas everyday i can't implement 😉
thanks for your time!, Martin.
Don't know if it is impossible but it can be done in some way if the developers ran by pass the firmware and the bluetooth specs and as u said have direct access to the hardware, just like ir remote works. But if this is possible then we may also have an application that makes our 7650 communicate with wifi networks (both bluetooth and wifi works on 2.4ghz)... But all these are just theories. If there were any interested developer we would have seen a bluetooth mmc reader for the 7650 by now...
i guess no dev made the step so far to address the bluetooth hardware directly... ir-remote hasn't been out for a long time, maybe this was a first test how to bypass the kernel-apis...??? so maybe the next quest is the bluetooth module... 😊
about using wifi networks... forget it... my company is also doing in wifi, and although the frequency is the same, everything else is different between bluetooth and wifi - and the real low-level functions are mostly built into hardware/asics... would be cute though.. 😊 alternative there is the LAN/IP Access Profile in bluetooth and there are some places (starbucks in usa i believe???) which offer public hot spots on bluetooth as well.. 😊
[quote="MemphisX"]I didn;t mean exactly that.
The whole coding in my opinion should be done by the 7650 cpu and then transmited as DATA to the bluetooth hansfree and be decoded from DATA to VOICE. The above solutions you've mentioned need an extra piece of hardware connected on 7650's hands free port. In other words they add an extra bluetooth device to make the job...[/quote]
As Nokia doesn't support BT audio, you'll need extra hardware somewhere. Either on the phone or the headset. As the current BT headsets don't accept BT data, they will need extra hardware to accept BT Data. It means extra bulk + costs either way.
[quote="MemphisX"]Don't know if it is impossible but it can be done in some way if the developers ran by pass the firmware and the bluetooth specs and as u said have direct access to the hardware, just like ir remote works. But if this is possible then we may also have an application that makes our 7650 communicate with wifi networks (both bluetooth and wifi works on 2.4ghz)... But all these are just theories. If there were any interested developer we would have seen a bluetooth mmc reader for the 7650 by now...[/quote]
If this can be done I'd be the first to buy it
Here it come the AUDIO BT issue again. If someone is looking for BT headset DO NOT buy a 7650.I think we've make pretty clear that there's no support for that and it's not very likely that there'll be in the future so FORGET ABOUT IT.
[quote="deathmonger"]Here it come the AUDIO BT issue again. If someone is looking for BT headset DO NOT buy a 7650.I think we've make pretty clear that there's no support for that and it's not very likely that there'll be in the future so FORGET ABOUT IT.[/quote]
Read the whole thread. You can get the Jabra headset with the 7650
if you'd all read the thread:
- i know that there is no bluetooth audio support in 7650
- i know about those so called "bluetooth" headsets that hook up with the phone via cable
i'm talking about the possibiliy of a application running on the 7650, implementing true bluetooth audio support.
I know that IT CAN BE DONE but it's just too messy and it needs, as you've already said special hardware. So, why anyone should go trough all that developing (soft and hard) when there's plenty of BT phones that support BT audio. It's just my opinion.
and i believe there is a market for such a program as there are many 7650 users that would like this feature - imho. therefore i was starting this thread... this was also a question in my post that started this thread... - what do the users think about it 😊
Maybe you should start a poll and see what results come out of it. That would also give dev. some idea on what the market expectations are like.
[quote="popsmart"]and i believe there is a market for such a program as there are many 7650 users that would like this feature - imho. therefore i was starting this thread... this was also a question in my post that started this thread... - what do the users think about it 😊[/quote]
I would love this option for 7650.
Yes there are many BT Audio phones out there, but none that would replace my 7650 at present
As far as I see it though, you must have added hardware. Either on phone (cant send Audio BT) or on headset (Cant receive Data BT). This means extra bulk and costs.
I just pointed out that there is already an option available. Yes it means adding hardware to phone, but I don't think you will get away without it. I'm sure developers would have developed something else if it was possible. After extra memory, Audio BT must be the most looked for addition to the 7650.
another thing that bugs me - where does this statement "it would need additional hardware" come frome... i've read this everywhere and for a long time... isn't this just a thought, maybe a rumour...??
do we know that there has to be extrea hardware...? who has the schematics and can surely know it...? noone... yepp... that's what i thought... soo.... is there any way to find this out....?
just because there are only bluetooth solutions for the 7650 using external hardware means nothing... those where built for phone having no bluetooth at all.... yes, they also work with 7650.. like with every other phone, just depends on the connector socket.
so.. who can proove we need extra hardware.... show us the schematics, show us what is missing...
hey... the phone can send and receive anything via data... bluetooth is using profiles... beside some sort of discovery profile which ev ery bluetooth device needs the 7650 has only the serial port profile implemented... so it only needs to implement the bluetooth headset profile... and guess what... those profiles are all done in software....
All I can say that if it merely requires a software fix, then why hasn't anyone bothered to do this. It will be a killer application and make a fortune. It will be bigger than a compression application
I agree with you Doc - if it's only software, even a 3rd party app built into the startup menu could activate that profile.
Nokia's had time to do this, and they haven't yet. So does that mean it's not possible.
I think I'll ask our friends at Psiloc...
Paul
Oh, well... The BT protocol says that there must be some bytes in each packet header, to indicate the kind of service (BT profile) is transmitting.
After this, you have to make your ADC and DAC of 7650 to work with the BT interface based on the Audio profile protocol of BT standard.
Who will start? :-? 😃
ADC/DAC??? what for...? voice data already arrives digitally over the gsm net and the headset sends the data from the microphone digitally... only need for 'forwarding' the data between the gsm and the bluetooth 'port'.... the only question is the profile implementation..... does the kernel need to be bypassed and the bluetooth module needs to be programmed directly...???
So, it sounds like it's just a matter of adding a new BT Service. If it's so easy why did not Nokia implement this feature? Sounds stupid. Anyway, ain't the knowledge... I hope someone comes with an app. that solves this lack.
[quote="popsmart"]ADC/DAC??? what for...? voice data already arrives digitally over the gsm net and the headset sends the data from the microphone digitally... only need for 'forwarding' the data between the gsm and the bluetooth 'port'.... the only question is the profile implementation..... does the kernel need to be bypassed and the bluetooth module needs to be programmed directly...???[/quote]
Wow! I found this topic after 2 months, but I want to reply... 😮ops: :P
When you speak to your headset microphone, your voice is passing through a ADC (8 bit resolution, 8 kHz sampling rate=64 kBps PCM), and then scrambled/coded/encrypted and then goes to the GSM net.
The opposite: The data from the GSM net, comes to your phone, decoded/de-scrambled/de-crypted, then goes to DAC, and finally to your speaker.
So, your DAC and ADC is working with your GSM Tx/Rx interface and coding/scrambling block. Now you have to make it work with your BT interface... That's what I wanted to say!
In a few words, IT CAN'T BE DONE.-