Yes, not Symbian, but an interesting new concept for smartphones and their working environment. The Foleo seems to be a dumb clamshell that piggybacks onto a smartphone's connectivity. I think it's a dumb idea as well, but comments welcome. Could this sort of idea catch on?
Read on in the full article.
Agree Steve... what a dumb idea and what a waste of time. Palm is despaired for survive:frown:
It might not be such a dumb idea. I just hope that it's not the big secret project that's been rumoured to be in development at Palm over the last few years because I agree that it would be a huge disapointment.
That said, the idea of a solid, reasonably cheap, very small and light device with a proper screen and keyboard that can connect wirelessly to your smartphone and work in symbiose with it could be a good idea.
Being able to check your emails, browse the web and edit Office documents on your smartphone is kinda cool but when it comes to get some real work done, you definitely need to have a proper large screen and keyboard, smartphones just aren't good enough for that. Laptops are perfect for that and can be bought cheaply these days but they're still large and heavy and very fragile (much more fragile than a smartphone). If your laptop breaks, settings up a new one, re-installing everything and restoring all your backups is a real hassle. On top of all that, laptop just don't work seemlessly with smartphones. They kind of synchronize but we all know the mess that sync currently is. Ultra-portable laptops and UMPC address the size and weight problem but they're very expensive and as or even more fragile than traditional laptops. Battery autonomy is also a big issue with laptop. You usually don't get more than 2-3 hours out of of a laptop battery.
Now, if you could have a very solid, very light and small device (presumably without a hard drive) with a decent autonomy that would integrate seemlessly with your smartphone without any wires without even having to think about it or configure anything and let you answer emails, browse the web and edit Office documents, view pictures and videos wherever you are on a large screen and with a proper keyboard, I think that this could be a winner. If the device breaks, it won't be a big deal since is really is just a screen and keyboard, it doesn't store anything. Certainly not a mass market product but I can see how such a device could be useful to a lot of people. Certainly more useful than a UMPC. After all, many smartphone users already use a bluetooth keyboard with their smartphone. This product just extends the idea and add a proper screen to the bluetooth keyboard which seems logical to me.
The main problem I see here is the price: $500 is still too expensive for such a device in my opinion. At $300 I think that I would buy it straight away (if there was a version that integrated with symbian smartphones that is).
I don't think the ideea is dumb, but I think they applied it badly. The ideea of being able to control your mobile from a full-sized keyboard and a normal size screen is one that will become very practical since the mobile phones are getting more and more powerfull.
However, having to cary an extra lap-top around just to see my emails just won't do now and I don't see it as catching on. When mobile phones will have the power to rival a lap-top or evan a desktop computer, this concept will become a must.
>>This product just extends the idea and add a proper screen to the bluetooth keyboard which seems logical to me.
Excellent insight. And, as an uber-accessory it's terrific. But as everyone's saying $500 for an accessory is crazy. $150 and they'd be selling well. $250 and they'd sell a few. $500 and they're dead in the water.
And for that sort of money, you can all have Nokia E90s and have your 800 pixel screen built-in from day one, with no increase in bulk 8-)
Steve
This device confuses my little brain.
It assumes that to read your e-mail on a big screen, you need the Foleo as though the small screen needs to have e-mail pulled from it. Last I knew, we've not that long managed to get e-mail onto the small screen and now they're talling me I don't want it there any more? And I don't need to sync my MacBook with my Smartphone to see my e-mail when I use IMAP or even POP on a web-based service (such a Googlemail).
I'm sorry, but when someone tells me that 'Wow! You can now see your e-mail on a big screen', I think they don't know what I want or how I want it. It sounds like the first Microsoft publicity attempts at its 'Smartphone' where they said At last, you can have ringtones that don't just beep, color screens and even view office documents' - like yeah, whatever, been doing that for ages already... YAWN!
I can't see me taking a Foleo anywhere that I wouldn't rather take my MacBook with my USB Wireless Modem, and when I don't want them, I can do pretty much everything else on my E61 or N73.
I personally think that this is a technological step backwards and it almost sounds like a Smartphone company admitting that its Smartphones aren't up to the job of being Smartphones.
I don't see this taking any market by storm... maybe by shower, but not by storm.
After having read about this Foleo a bit more here and there, it appears that this device really is the top-secret palm project that everybody was hoping would bring Palm back to fame and limelight.
As much as I think that this Foleo could be an interesting device if it was cheaper, I can't really see how this is going to get Palm out of the deep trouble they're into at the moment. This is obviously a niche market device (especially if it only works with Palm smartphones). That probably won't be enough to entice former Palm users to go back to Palm or new users to buy Palm smartphones.
Unless the Foleo is just half of their big secret project and the other half is an unanounced über cool smartphone that will blow all the competition away...
Surely this is simply an updated echo of the Psion Netbook / Series 7
Have to agree, interesting concept but the price completely utterly ruins it. The real point of "going dumb" is to keep the costs down so you just pay for the screen and keyboard, but they clearly haven't done that if it costs $500 (plus about 20% tax on top of that here in Europe).
In fact it's actually $600, not $500. You have to get a "mail in rebate" to get the price down to $500, which is itself an "introductory offer".
At $600 or even $500 this is just crazy, you could buy a brand new laptop for that kind of money and use any brand phone's connectivity through USB or bluetooth (even non-smart low-end phones let you use them as modems nowadays).
There's also the problem that people generally buy smartphones because they want something pocket sized. If they can cope with something laptop sized then they'll buy a laptop, especially if it costs the same as a Foleo.
There's a bit in the site's official presentation which says "See files on a big screen without dragging out your laptop"... If you can't be bothered to carry a laptop, why exactly would you be bothered to carry a Foleo?
Why carry a Foleo, if not a laptop? I guess the same reason that the Netbook was once such an ace device:
- Instant on/off, no waiting 30-60 seconds to "un-hibernate".
- Rather smaller & lighter than 99% of laptops. Think of it as a large book.
- Longer battery life than most laptops, so no need to worry about being near a power point (until charging it at night).
- Possibly more robust?
- Simpler, and so easier to use.
- Simpler, and so more reliable (less to go wrong).
- No worries about viruses!
But I'm personally not interested in the Foleo, because it lacks a touch screen.
> If you can't be bothered to carry a laptop, why exactly would you be bothered to carry a Foleo?
We'll have to wait and see how thin, light and robust this foleo really is (I couldn't find any info about that on the web site). Laptops are still large, heavy and fragile. You can get ultra portables which are very small and light but far too expensive for most. And still fragile. You don't just throw your laptop in your backpack as you'd throw your bluetooth foldable keyboard in.
Now, if Foleo is as light and robust as I hope it is, it means that it's gonna be just like carrying a bluetooth foldable keyboard with a 10'' screen as a bonus which is going to be a lot more practical than carrying your laptop around for all those times when you don't really need the processing power and applications of a laptop but still need to be able to keep up with your emails and write a report on the go. Hopefully it'll charge using the phone's charger so you won't have to carry an extra charger either.
I can really see how such a device could be useful for some if the price was right. I've personnaly been most unimpressed with Tablet PCs and UMPCs but this kind of device would be fantastic for me. Instead of having to constantly carry a huge smartphone such as an E90, I could have phone-sized one such as the N73 which is perfect for the day-to-day life and throw my Foleo in my backpack whenever i'm going away on week-ends, businness trips or hollidays to be able to check emails, browse the web and do some work comfortably wherever I am. No need to carry 4kg of laptop equipement and worry about damaging an expensive laptop or having to find a way to fit that massive E90 in my pocket (I'm not saying that I won't get an E90 though 😉 )
I thought about the idea of having a separate screen and keyboard and just bluetooth your smart phone's brian ever since Psion pull out of consumers' market, forcing me to use small smart phone. Yea, there have been Nokia's communtors, but weekdays is fine, who want to carry a brick to the beach? So I was talking to my friend about designing a screen and keyboard combo accessory at least 3 years ago. I of course have neither the resource or experience to implement the idea.
But I am happy to see someone is putting this idea onto the market. However I envisioned the screen and keyboard combo would be more like the size of a Psion 5MX, and the matching smartphone would be more razor like. I think carrying a large Treo smartphone and a laptop size screen and keyboard just miss the plot, not taking full advantage the concept. Who doesn't want to carry the smallest phone to pubs and clubs, 5mx sized screen and keyboard for travel, and only full laptop when you absolutely have to.
One key point, one advantage of this concept over a laptop is there is no synchronisation needed. You are editing a single source on fly, one the move, All your contents will always stored in once place and be with you whereever you go.
Ray
Apparently, foleo is a PC itself runing Linux, instead of instead of just sending keystoke and screen from the phone via blue tooth. Its still work through synchronsition/file upload download. that explains why its so dame expensive.
Surely someone (Nokia? Sony listening? ) would eventually just put in more powerful CPU into the smartphone, update the OS to support an external Blue tooth screen and keyboard combo (much like setting up a secondary monitor to your laptop or pc). Done, Cheap simple and sweet! Can I patent this idea?
Ray
Another 'take' on all this is to note that the Foleo has Wi-Fi and forget the Treo sync bit. Now look at it as an instant-on large-screened, keyboarded email and web device, good for staying in touch with your work and the world within range of known Wi-Fi hotspots (e.g. airports/work). That's not a bad concept, given how much of today's world is web-hosted.
I guess they threw in the fact that it was a Treo companion to keep Palm shareholders happy. Personally, I think the Foleo is starting to make more sense as a standalone and that the 'Companion' bit should refer to keeping you company rather than a smartphone!
Arguably still a bit niche though...! Will the laptop generation 'get it'? There's more hope there than trying to win over the smartphone generation!
Steve Litchfield
According to a ZDNet article, the Foleo "syncs up with a smart phone running Windows Mobile or Palm OS over a Bluetooth connection". Why does no-one ever bother supporting Symbian?!?
Regarding price, that same ZDNet article says: "But the attractive price could help sway some converts. The average U.S. retail cost of an ultraportable laptop was $1,778 in the first quarter of this year. That compares with the $851 it cost to buy an average laptop, and the $499 Palm wants for the Foleo, according to Current Analysis West."
Personally, despite the expense, I'm keeping my eye on the Panasonic CF-T5. It's basically got the size,weight, robustness, battery life & touch screen of a Netbook. (Sadly this web site won't let me post a web link.)
the Foleo is about being a s/w platform for Palm s/w. I have used Palm PDAs for many years and I still use a Clie TH55 with my SE P990/M600. Palm PIM s/w is superb and is really constrained by Outlook. Outlook's model of PIM is very simplistic. Look at Agendus, Life Balance and other great Palm apps. Now if Palm can provide an easy re-platforming option you have the choice of not using Outlook and using lots of great Palm apps in a mini laptop and syncing to your Palm Smartphone/PDA. I am very interested in the Foleo as I really value great and simple s/w, which is what Palm is about.
> According to a ZDNet article, the Foleo "syncs up with a smart phone running Windows Mobile or Palm OS over a Bluetooth connection". Why does no-one ever bother supporting Symbian?!?
Foleo is a Palm product. Palm sells smartphones running Palm OS and Windows Mobile. Makes sense to support only these 2 OS at least at the start. If you look at the video on the web site, you'll see that they consider extending the Foleo concept to just every other OS and mobile phone platform. So there is a hope that a Symbian version will come.
Isn´t this PALM thing more or less similar to this SE concept???
> Isn�t this PALM thing more or less similar to this SE concept???
Not really. The SE one is a large craddle intended to be used at home. It's not meant to be a portable device but a replacement for a home PC or a home media center which given the limitations of today's smartphones is not going to have much appeal (it could have some success in a few years time when smartphones will be able to store dozens of GB of data and be powerful enough to effectively replace a traditional computer for what most people do at home).
I think you might be missing the point. This device competes with the Nokia N800 (which haven't heard anyone proclaiming as pointless). It's a wifi web tablet.The fact that it also functions as a nice interface for a smartphone is just a bonus.
The main problem with the device is the price, but then it does have a decent keyboard and screen which will give it a leg up over the N800 for some people.
This is a pretty gutsy move from a company of Palm's limited scale. I hope it works out for them but I've got to say I think it's unlikely. It's too expensive for a casual consumer purchase and Windows is so entrenched in the enterprise that this can not be more than a niche device in big business. This is not like the original Palms that got carried in addition to a laptop. It's too big for an exec to carry alongside a PC.
If this is going to work for Palm they need to market it to small businesses and individual "knowledge workers" like consultants (which is the market where smartphones have had the most success interestingly). Is that a big enough market to make the device profitable? Or influential enough to drive it into the mainstream?
I suspect not.
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I like the way this "totally new product concept" completley ignores the Nokia web tablets. This is pretty much the same idea but with a real keyboard. In truth I rather like the idea, I'd prefer to see it pocket sized... but then it would be an old school Psion. 😊
"This device competes with the Nokia N800 (which haven't heard anyone proclaiming as pointless). It's a wifi web tablet."
The Foleo is just too big to be compared to a N800. The N800, if it has a purpose, is to provide something very small and portable just for looking at the internet now and then.
The N800 is actually pretty small when you use one in real life, it's just about small enough to fit in a large suit pocket or an average-size handbag, and you can hold an N800 in one hand. It's not much bigger than an E61:
http://www.neoncherry.com/gadgetpictureshow/images/nokian800/n800comparedtoe61.jpg
At its size and price, the only obvious competitor for the Foleo's business is the laptop, but a laptop has more functionality at about the same price, so why would anyone buy a Foleo?
This is what Palm are really saying:
1. There will be a new OS for Treos
2. Treos will get smaller and much more powerful
3. Treos will have massive storage
4. People will carry around their Treos as the real personal computer
5. Foleo like devices allow easy access to the massive amounts of data on the real PC, the Treo
So the real story is not about the Foleo but the future of mobile devices. People will have at least two: one with everything but used mainly in read mode and one for content creation. The Psion 5 and Revo attempted to do both tasks and I think this is still possible.
