Nokia 5800 Navigation Edition - bundle value

i remember when "comes with maps", "comes with with whatever" was slightly joked about here when comes with music was introduced.just goes to show you you never can tell just what nokia are about to do.

Do they plan Nokia 5800 Navigation Edition comes with Music Edition? 😊

Too bad Nokia (or Ovi, depends where you look 😊 Maps 3 is very sub-par navigation software. I use TomTom GO with IQRoutes, compared to that navigating with my 5800 is a joke:
- sometimes very slow GPS fix (with AGPS turned on)
- GPS is not precise - late instructions (turn right just after the turn)
- small unreadable text on the small, dim screen (unreadable in sunlight)
- very basic routing algorithms (nothing like IQRoutes is availible)
- no possibility to add POIs
- slow animation in 3D
- sometimes very bizarre instructions
- very poor lane guidance
- it is practically impossible to review planned route in detail
- unstable - can crash and quit for no reason
- phone gets VERY hot when mounted on windscreen

Nokia Maps is nice as a mapping reference software (good maps), with Ovi synchronization, but for navigation it's a pain.

I've found Ovi Maps to be perfectly fine for my usage level (admittedly rather light). Certainly the convenience of having things in the phone means I never used by Tom Tom device any more. To be fair I mainly just use the audio instruction without looking at the screen much so maybe it depends on your usage mode?

I've said before that if you do a lot of traveling a stand alone device may be more desirable. I think the main angle here is to underline the value aspect - you can't get an equivalent PND for the extra cost of the Navigation Edition (�40 ish) over a standard 5800... especially if you get it as part of a contract bundle.

I found a 60 quid TomTom One solved all my in car requirements. NO phone solution works anywhere near as well as the dedicated unit for in car.

I suspect this bundle is almost certainly a direct response to the release of TomTom on the iPhone. And if you think Ovi Maps on the 5800 is bad (and actually it's probably pretty good), wait until you see just how bad TT is on iPhone. The iPhone GPS hardware is barely up to the job, and that's just for starters. Of course, you can blow a load more cash on the custom separate GPS unit for iPhone TT, but really is it worth it? There comes a point at which even the most blindly dogmatic iPhone lover has to say 'enough is enough, this is getting ridiculous'.

We Nokia owners should count our blessings and think ourselves lucky. By and large we get fantastic software and hardware solutions for a fraction of the price of other overhyped rubbish.

Response to Unregistered 11:15am

What a stupid ignorant response to what was an informative article.
Why must people always blast the iPhone as 'OVERHYPED RUBBISH' - are you for real??

I've had Nokia for years but now have an iPhone and I don't come into this forum slagging off Nokia phones. At least be objective and mature in your replies to peoples comments.

Oh and by the way - count your blessings if you like, but I for one am pleased to own an iPhone - probably because I can afford one. But I still don't come here bashing Nokia phones. And finally, if you really think the iPhone is 'overhyped rubbish' and that you get 'fantastic software' and 'hardware solutions' for a 'fraction of the price', then your deluded.

Lately, I am sick of going to every mobile phone blog and forum and reading about how people love their iphones. It's even starting to infect Symbian blogs which is giving me the shits. All these once upon a time Symbian fans that just love the iphone since switching. Well good luck to you but I don't care. I don't care about the iphone because if I did, I would buy one.

Not bad, the mounts and a lifetime licence for less than the original 5800 retail price!

From the video, it looks like in this Navigation Edition they've finally enabled landscape mode operation in Maps. Hopefully this improvement will find its way to the regular 5800 in some future firmware upgrade, but I wouldn't hold my breath.

It would seem stupid to count out Nokia out of the smartphone race. But I think they really hit their peak and are on their spiral down.

Unregistered wrote:I found a 60 quid TomTom One solved all my in car requirements. NO phone solution works anywhere near as well as the dedicated unit for in car.

Nowhere near, why is that? I much prefer phone navigation actually, even on an N82 with its small screen. I suppose the reasons are no surprise, but let me list them anyway:
It is always with you. No need to be afraid of it being stolen because you left it in the car, you can program it beforehand, you can use it on foot, it's lightweight etc.

The programs themselves are the same really, at least I've seen Tomtom and Sygic units with almost exactly the same software as there is for S60.

Apart from that, I had a 3 month license of Nokia maps 3.0 (it was the license I got with my N82 and never used before 😊, and I actually think it is really good. High frame rate, fast route calculation, always up to date maps, good POI database. I don't remember it ever crashing either. What I did miss is searching for a POI near my destination.
No IQroutes, true, but to call it ' very basic' just because of that...I do think the price is still a bit high though.

When I was on my N95, I had used it as a portable GPS unit quite extensively and while I've replaced it with an N97, I would say that arguably, the experience has just improved.

My biggest issue with using Maps on the phone is when a call comes in the middle of a turn-by-turn guidance.

From my personal experience designing and using cars with built-in GPS systems, portable GPS systems and mobile-based systems, there really isn't that big a gap, if any, between portable and mobile systems, sometimes it just boils down to personal preference.

Where there is a gap is when you compare them with integrated navigation systems where you get the benefit of inertial navigation, persistent location memory and other advantages when you have an anchored system that can obtain additional telemetry beyond satellite data and heading.

I've found Maps 3.0 to be fantastic and use it along with the occasional CoPilot. I've also tried Garmin, NDrive, Sygic and Navigon but wasn't very impressed with those. Caveat is I use them on my N95 8GB so can't speak for the 5800 - I'd imagine the higher res would be better, but the lack of 3d chip might slow it down ?

Sitting in an aquabox on a motorcycle, Maps 3 navigated me around Europe no problem earlier in the year, and I had installed thousands of campsite poi's which made it indispensible. Bluetooth to the helmet for voice directions (which my mates particular Garmin couldn't do) was great. It was very fast, recalculated after missing a turn almost instantaneously, was totally reliable etc etc, unlike my mate's Garmin which continually shut itself off and lost all his routes and poi's.

Also, having just the one device for multiple purposes was fantastic, convergence rules on a bike trip. No more faffing about with multiple chargers, leads, batteries, trying to pack them all away and so on.
I won't ever be going back to standalone units again.

I can't be the first one to point out a major flaw here. The screen is terrible in direct sunlight. How good that gonna be on the dashboard on a sunny day?

I don't know how well maps 3.0 works in the US. My N95-4 has the older version and it's just terrible. Has anyone in the US tried using Maps 3.0 with Ovi? How satisfied are you with its accuracy? the lifetime license is a great value but for how long would this service be supported by Nokia on symbian platform. Maemo is the new rising star for Nokia seems like.

I have used Nokia Maps 2 and 3 on my 5800. I have also used a couple of other stand-alone in-car navigators. I must say, I haven't seen a stand-alone navigator beat 5800's satellite lock time even without internet connection. The same goes for route calculation - much better than all the stand-alone navigators I've tried (didn't try TomTom). And although there are things to complain about Maps 3 there are many more thing that point for it.
Pro:
- fast satellite lock (>20 sec in any condition)
- save favourite places, routes and synchronise with Ovi. Synchronise all your family's phones with the same Ovi account.
- create routes on a computer with Ovi Maps
- fast interface
- satisfactory route calculation
- free maps
Cons:
- poor maps for Eastern Europe
- seldom crashes
- the interface needs some work
- voice instructions come late (~10 meters later)

And the biggest drawback is it doesn't work on iPhone or Android because broke my 5800 and the iPhone is coming tomorrow. I'm going to miss it. Nokia Maps and Sportstracker.

maartenmk wrote:Nowhere near, why is that? I much prefer phone navigation actually, even on an N82 with its small screen. I suppose the reasons are no surprise, but let me list them anyway:
It is always with you. No need to be afraid of it being stolen because you left it in the car, you can program it beforehand, you can use it on foot, it's lightweight etc.

No. I tried the phone. Hopeless. Hopeless daytime vis, poxy speakers, slow performance, ongoing costs etc. But the most ridiculous flaw was the fact that its main purpose was as a communications device, primarily voice and when it was doing it's day job I was missing the turns.

You can program a TomTom beforehand too. It's dedicated interface is optimised for use on the move with enormous simple touch buttons and minimal interaction required - and you can see it clearly in bright sunshine.

It's also lightweight and you can use a TomTom on foot, but I've got my phone for that. At walking pace turn by turn navigation isn't necessary, you just follow the map on the screen.

People don't worry about getting them stolen anymore now they are �50-�60 devices, a few ears ago they were �200 plus they used to be a problem but not now. �400-�500 smartphones are far more lucrative targets.

The prosecution rests m'lud.

Of all the below points by someone..

I only agree on
- it is practically impossible to review planned route in detail -- this is a real drawback.
- phone gets VERY hot when mounted on windscreen -- Might be true and sure it happens with any device.
- and ofcourse dataentry via mini qwerty keyboard is difficult.

Don't know about IQRouting.. so no comments on that.

My 5800 + ovi maps 3.0 gets a signal within 3 seconds. And for my dedicated Tom Tom One take about a min or more and sometimes needs a restart.

IQRoutes, compared to that navigating with my 5800 is a joke:
- sometimes very slow GPS fix (with AGPS turned on)
- GPS is not precise - late instructions (turn right just after the turn)
- small unreadable text on the small, dim screen (unreadable in sunlight)
- very basic routing algorithms (nothing like IQRoutes is availible)
- no possibility to add POIs
- slow animation in 3D
- sometimes very bizarre instructions
- very poor lane guidance
- it is practically impossible to review planned route in detail
- unstable - can crash and quit for no reason
- phone gets VERY hot when mounted on windscreen

In summary, everybody has their own preferred navigation solution, which automatically disqualifies everything else.

Sigh, every comment thread ends up in "my preferences > yours" nowadays :/

fernando20 wrote:In summary, everybody has their own preferred navigation solution, which automatically disqualifies everything else.

Sigh, every comment thread ends up in "my preferences > yours" nowadays :/

It's a shame, I agree. But I guess people always feel a need to defend their decision. It's human nature. I succumb too.

But on to opinions -

I agree that dedicated units have an interface that's better optimised for in car use.
I also agree that there's a definite advantage of not losing your navigation when taking a call - I've only rarely used my phone for navigating, so not taken a call during nav - can't say what happens.

However, I think that only having one device & holder stuck to the window has got to be better than two. And I also think the future is a connected, converged device.

On the performance side, my 6220 has fantastic lock times and sensitivity, but my etrex has better accuracy (5ft is the best I've seen on it!).

Dedicated car units don't have to worry about licence fees, but you have to pay for map updates.

In the 5800's favour, you have a device that has unlimited navigation with free, lifetime map updating. I've not checked how much lifetime map update deals are for garmin/tomtom et al - does it compare?

At the end of the day we all make our choices, and there will always be some who have to belittle yours in order to justify their own. Those are the people who's opinions don't matter, and fortunately they're not difficult to spot. 😊

The touch interface on Maps 3 is unbelievably terrible... (on 5800). Nokia should ask somebody to use this software in the s car at least once 😊 And then buy one unit from TomTom, test the interface and make Maps interface similarly usable without stylus, mini qwerty and all this nonsense.

Personally, I've found the interface on the latest TomTom units to be creaking at the edges; they've added so many extra things, compared to the original units, that when setting preferences, for example, you sometimes have to page through several screens to get the option you want.

Tap one too many times on 'Next', and you have to go through all those screens again, to get to the option you want to change.

Yes, IQ routes is handy, but it's not the be all and end-all - and it's expensive. I did a recent group test of 'high end' satnav for one of the final issues of PCW, and you're looking at an ongoing cost of �7.95 per quarter for map updates, plus �7.99 after the first three months for the IQ services.

Buy the 'Go 740 Live' version (european maps, which was what we looked at), and the cost - including purchase - over two years, assuming you keep up with all the subscriptions, would be �554.39

I also found that x40 series just wasn't as loud as the older models; the desire for thinness has made them use weedier speakers, and though better than many other standalone devices which were almost inaudible at speed, and the hands free functionality wasn't that good.

Personally, I much prefer using my phone for satnav; I used to use Navicore but now use Maps 3, since Wayfinder messed up Navicore. And I have a parrot ck3100 in the car. So instructions are always clear, and override the audio system, and the spoke instructions are far more important than looking at the screen.

Nobody's going to run out crazy and wait on line to buy this; but it does offer an extra bonus to those that might care.

People that have no sense of direction might want this extra feature when traveling on foot.

This of course will not replace a real GPS; like many people here this device is not at a level where we can rely on it with confidence.