The Phones Show 93 and Phones Show Chat 10

Steve, i have to agree with you, the N97 mini is also my favorite phone and deserves very well the Nr. 1 spot. The N97 is nice but the N97 mini is better b/c its smaller thats all, it makes it so much better! Although i'm not very found on the color, the bronze look is just not my favorite color (even the black one has some kinda weird colors in the back)!

Nokia make a black and a white version and you're good to go. Ohhhh and �450 is wayyy too hiiigh for the smaller sibling, it should be cheaper than the N97....around �350 max!!!

I see a contradiction in your 1st place contender. You've said you want to have fm transmitter and N97 mini doesn't have it :/

It's a pity the .mp4 doesn't play in Real Player . I have only got audio .
So two Chats today ....

😊 Regards jApi NL

The VGA MP4 isn't for mobiles - please download the QVGA version instead, which is encoded for mobile viewing.

Re: FM. Some spec sheets say the mini *has* FM - some say not. I guess I'm not going to know for sure until I (or one of you) actually buy one!!

Ah, so you admit you haven't even tested the N97 mini, yet you declared it #1.
You just lost any credibility you had left.

slitchfield wrote:
Re: FM. Some spec sheets say the mini *has* FM - some say not. I guess I'm not going to know for sure until I (or one of you) actually buy one!!

slitchfield wrote:The VGA MP4 isn't for mobiles

Er, no. What you meant to say is that isn't for mobiles that can't play VGA. Works just fine on the i8910. Ironic that the phone you are always so willing to dismiss is the only 5th edition phone that plays your video.

I've told you this before, but i guess it's easier to just say that no mobiles will play it rather than admit there is a 5th edition, non-Nokia device that CAN.

In addition, from the Phone chat; "With the Symbian 5th edition phones, the dialer is just a plain dialer"

Wrong again, the i8910 has an alpha numeric keypad. See attached. (edit: of course you'll have to click through to the actual forum to see the pic. More irony; that the biggest symbian site also has a UI that you have to double click down through the options to get to what you want...)

For Tim; "Mobbler. It just wouldn't work. It looks like it should work, but it doesn't work on the N97".

Probably accurate. However, I have Mobbler on my i8910, and it works just fine. Even had someone involved with Mobbler test it out (at the pub meet) and been very impressed with how it worked on the i8910.

And yes, a lot of Nokia apps work on other 5th edition devices, often without any certificate issues, or Steve's 'H word'. With Symbian now opening its own software store, the list will only get longer.

So there is a 5th edition device that plays VGA, has an alpha numeric keypad, and will run the same apps that the N97 has, and even apps that it can't. And yet you seem so ready to dismiss it.

Sounding bitter? Probably.

Finally siding with the "Sponsored by Nokia" camp? Absolutely.

Okay Steve. The N97 has not been tested but it's number one. LOL...LOL...LOL

Congratulations on steering traffic to your site by being controversial. Well done.

just can't understand this. Take a failed phone and make it smaller and then sell it more or less the same price as the original? They are supposed to be innovating and hashing out Maemo based snap dragons with keyboards at least 4 inch displays, OLED, hardware graphics acceleration, and xenon flash for god sakes if they want to remain competitive.

UKJeeper -
And yes, a lot of Nokia apps work on other 5th edition devices, often without any certificate issues, or Steve's 'H word'.

'H word' ????

Arcade wrote:'H word' ????

Hack.

>>Ah, so you admit you haven't even tested the N97 mini, yet you declared it #1.
You just lost any credibility you had left.

On the contrary, I've played with 3 or 4 N97 minis over the course of about 4 or 5 hours on Monday and Tuesday, plus I know the software (and much of the hardware) intimately. I just haven't had one here back at base and for some *inexplicable* reason I forgot to double-check the FM transmitter. Gah. I'll be gutted if this is, in fact, missing.

>>Er, no. What you meant to say is that isn't for mobiles that can't play VGA. Works just fine on the i8910. Ironic that the phone you are always so willing to dismiss is the only 5th edition phone that plays your video.

The i8910 HD isn't the only S60 phone which (helpfully) plays the VGA feed. What I mean is that the QVGA feed is encoded for much wider compatibility. You lot really are argumentative today....

>>Wrong again, the i8910 has an alpha numeric keypad.

Good point. In its latest Italian firmware anyway. I guess I should have clarified my point to say 'Nokia' 5th Edition phones.

>>So there is a 5th edition device that plays VGA, has an alpha numeric keypad, and will run the same apps that the N97 has, and even apps that it can't. And yet you seem so ready to dismiss it.

I'm always ready to give the i8910 HD the time of day. It's a great bit of hardware. But Samsung have largely ignored us users, leaving us to scrounge around for assorted foreign language firmwares and to hack together custom ROMs. *That's* the bit I don't like.

>>and hashing out Maemo based snap dragons with keyboards at least 4 inch displays, OLED, hardware graphics acceleration, and xenon flash for god sakes if they want to remain competitive.

Umm.... what you're describing doesn't sound like something which could be sold at less than about �600. I guess you mean 'technologically' competitive, not 'economically' competitive?

>>'H word' ????

He means 'Hack'. I'm not averse to a little legal hacking here and there, but a site as huge as AAS can't possibly steer people down that route - it's a recipe for annoyed companies and screwed up newbie users....

slitchfield wrote:
The i8910 HD isn't the only S60 phone which (helpfully) plays the VGA feed. What I mean is that the QVGA feed is encoded for much wider compatibility. You lot really are argumentative today....

I didn't say S60, i said 5th edition. I'm sure there are other phones that can handle VGA. Unfortunately none of the other 5th edition phones are on that list. So #1 and #2 on your top 5 (6?) are unable to watch their own podcast in VGA resolution....

slitchfield wrote:Good point. In its latest Italian firmware anyway. I guess I should have clarified my point to say 'Nokia' 5th Edition phones.

At this point i think if you had to admit something like that your throat would swell shut, preventing the admission.

slitchfield wrote:I'm always ready to give the i8910 HD the time of day. It's a great bit of hardware. But Samsung have largely ignored us users, leaving us to scrounge around for assorted foreign language firmwares and to hack together custom ROMs. *That's* the bit I don't like.

My understanding (from reading around) is that it might not be Samsungs fault. They rolled out the other firmwares in response to requests/pressure from the carriers (eg; TIM in Italy). As long as their UK customer for the i8910 (Orange is their 'customer', not the end user. And we know what their idea of firmware is...:rolleyes😊 don't request it, they have no reason to make an improved UK version. Shame you seemed to waste your opportunity to ask the Samsung guy "where's the UK firmware?" "while you had a recorder in his face.

Fortunately there are other people (on other sites) who don't accept the status quo and do something about it. *That's* the bit i DO like.

We're geeks, not sheeple. We don't accept being told "thats the way it is, you can't change it". He11, even the fruit owners don't accept that line, and they are the biggest swarm of drones i know!

"My understanding (from reading around) is that it might not be Samsungs fault. They rolled out the other firmwares in response to requests/pressure from the carriers (eg; TIM in Italy). As long as their UK customer for the i8910 (Orange is their 'customer', not the end user. And we know what their idea of firmware is...:rolleyes😊 don't request it, they have no reason to make an improved UK version. Shame you seemed to waste your opportunity to ask the Samsung guy "where's the UK firmware?" "while you had a recorder in his face."

So umm..... you answer your own question earlier in your own paragraph?

As usual, when a phone company doesn't consider end users their 'customers', everything has the potential to go pear shaped.... If we had to wait for networks to get round to logging bugs and asking for fixes then we'd all grow old before anything got done. Which is why we at AAS never flinch at telling Nokia what's wrong (when necessary) - and they DO listen sometimes, witness the terrific N86 dialog in the forums.

Ok, i wasn't quite clear (even to myself) perhaps. Samsung obviously answers to the end user, as does any manufacturer. Make a bad product, no-one will buy it.

But what i am trying to say is that Samsung makes a firmware for its UK customer, Orange. Orange buys the phone from Samsung and sells it on to us. Orange tells Samsung what is and isn't going to be on the firmware. Its Oranges branded firmware.

Unless Samsung is going to start going around Orange and other carriers and release its own non-branded firmware, available for any product code(which isn't going to happen), Orange will be the decider on what and when any future UK firmware is released.

So, imo, Orange is the UK 'customer' who tells Samsung what they want on the phone, not us.

So is railing against Samsung for the notsogreat UK firmware going to make a difference? It might make Samsung go to Orange and tell them its time to make improvments.

But 'end of the day' Orange is the one who decides if we get a better branded firmware.

Had issues with the V20 my N97 kept saying it was out of memory!! Couldn't even send sms but could receive. Running good so far after I reinstalled it twice; but I did notice I do have an alpha numeric keypad for the dialer now WooHoo lol. i have the n.american version

I'm really surprised Steve. To keep the i8910 off the list entirely and put the N97 at the top just seems...inaccurate. If your list is designed to make recommendations to prospective smartphone buyers, I have a hard time believing that type of user would be more impressed by the N97 than any of the other devices on the list.

jonnybruha wrote:I'm really surprised Steve. To keep the i8910 off the list entirely and put the N97 at the top just seems...inaccurate.

I didn't. I put the Nokia N97 *mini* at the top of the list - the N97 wasn't, technically, IN the list. Have you TRIED a mini yet - really nice second iteration, better build quality, with only a few compromises over the N97 (e.g. capacity)

slitchfield wrote: the N97 wasn't, technically, IN the list. (e.g. capacity)

Erm, what? Did i watch the wrong podcast?

The one i watched definitely seemed to have an N97 mentioned in your list. In fact for a phone that wasn't "IN the list", it got the most airtime of all SIX of your top five. BTW, you don't appear at any point to say the N97 is NOT on the list, but you do spend lots of time justifying the N97's well known shortcoming's (I didn't go to Uni, Is 'caveat's' latin for 'excuses'?).

Maybe you should make a new top 5. Call it, oh, i don't know, The top 5 of under powered, low rammed, poorly built, self mutilating phones that you should still go out and buy.

UKJeeper wrote:For Tim; "Mobbler. It just wouldn't work. It looks like it should work, but it doesn't work on the N97". Probably accurate.

Turns out that this is *not* accurate - after a second hard reset of the N97 and 'start again' procedure Mobbler works fine.

Tim

timsalmon wrote:Turns out that this is *not* accurate - after a second hard reset of the N97 and 'start again' procedure Mobbler works fine.

Tim

That's good news. Thanks Tim.

slitchfield wrote:Have you TRIED a mini yet - really nice second iteration, better build quality, with only a few compromises over the N97 (e.g. capacity)

Nope I haven't tried a Mini yet. Given that, with a caveat* it isn't even generally on sale yet, I doubt many people have.

Really Steve, how to you justify recommending a phone that is not even available to purchase yet as the phone you would most recommend people should go out and purchase? Can you see the paradox there? Maybe? Just a little bit? A teensy weensy lil bit?!?

A bad case of premature recommendation I think. There are pills to help you.

* Caveat: yeah available to order on Expansys or Vodaphone - but have you seen one in the shops yet?

@morpheus: Yes, they've been on sale in shops for at least a week or so. I was playing with one in the High Street in Reading last Saturday (i.e. 8 days ago).

I wish you guys would give me some credit, it's very annoying when you slam me as if I've got an IQ of 80. I deliberately waited for my Top 5(6) until

a) N97 v20 was out and I could assess its worth
b) the N97 mini was available in the shops

I had LOADS of people suggesting I recommend other devices which aren't out yet (e.g. E72, N900, Droid, HD2), but I completely agree: I can't recommend something which isn't available.

Which is why the Nokia N97 mini came out no.1, with my recommendation.

Have to take your word for it Steve, I've not seen any N97 minis anywhere and they certainly didn't have them in the Regent Street store on Wednesday.

So it's a foregone conclusion that the phone is going to rate highly when it is reviewed on the site?

N97 mini a #1? What a joke. Yet another under powered piece of c**p from Finland.

>>Have to take your word for it Steve, I've not seen any N97 minis anywhere and they certainly didn't have them in the Regent Street store on Wednesday.

Maybe they all sold out because they're popular? They certainly had them the previous weekend/Mon/Tue. I could certainly have bought one in Reading, but am waiting to see when a loan review unit arrives from Nokia.... Rafe funds quite a few review purchases, but borrowing them from Nokia when possible saves his bank reserves 8-)

>>So it's a foregone conclusion that the phone is going to rate highly when it is reviewed on the site?

Well, it's looking likely. I've had a pretty decent play already. Just need to double-check a few things and try using the device for a solid week etc.

Its great to see the N97 getting some good press and well justified with the feature list you said.

Even though I am an N97 owner, I was surprised to see it at the top of your list. There are better phones out there, surely there are? I am still awaiting V20 (UK unlocked/unbranded) so when it arrives, I may think its the phone I wanted to love otherwise it will be the HD2 for me! It has left me wondering if you are receiving any sponsors from Finland. It reminds me a bit of Engadget. One minute they hate Nokia, next they dont and then a day later it was announced that Nokia will be sponsoring their show I believe.

Besides that, great show. Dont let anyone else put you down mate. Most forums etc are full of fanboys always looking for the opportunity to bash someone who doesnt rate the device they have.