[QUOTE=Mr Mark;426887]And an E71 for work. You seem to have missed that part.
Yup, this apple employee always misses 'parts' conveniently for the sake of his arguments. Remember the one he pulled on Steve a few weeks back (that 'shutup' thing)? Very 'professionally' done.
Unregistered wrote:Hah! Gotcha. Proves you are nothing but a guesser and a wrong one at that.I still can't figure out what the axe is that you need to grind. I mean, if you hate Symbian and S60 so much then why don't you just go and buy a toyphone and forget about Symbian and S60? Why do you feel the need to keep telling everybody that you don't like it? Why the personal crusade? Are you the person with the vested interest bias? Or is it that you just can't bear to be wrong all the time and must maintain this futile attempt to convince others?
Let me explain, hopefully it won't be too hard for you to comprehend.
I have been purchasing and using Nokia Symbian phones for a long time. It is my right to express my opinion on this forum and elsewhere. Just as it is to express yours. Now, it is my opinion that S60 touch sucks and sucks balls big time. Get it?
You might ask: "who cares what Arthur thinks". And you're right.
Therefore I presented to you Scott Weiss, one of the top managers at Symbian who also thinks S60 sucks. There are many other voices in the industry that say it sucks. Or will you in your ignorance bash the Symbian manager too?
Arthur wrote:Let me explain, hopefully it won't be too hard for you to comprehend.I have been purchasing and using Nokia Symbian phones for a long time. It is my right to express my opinion on this forum and elsewhere. Just as it is to express yours. Now, it is my opinion that S60 touch sucks and sucks balls big time. Get it?
You might ask: "who cares what Arthur thinks". And you're right.
Therefore I presented to you Scott Weiss, one of the top managers at Symbian who also thinks S60 sucks. There are many other voices in the industry that say it sucks. Or will you in your ignorance bash the Symbian manager too?
You're the 1 having a hard time comprehending anything here. Everyone knows you've been a Nokia user all your life coz you've been repeating it all the time like our grandmothers! In your crusade to put Nokia back on track, you are rude and you offend a lot of people, so COMPREHEND that first. And yes we know how to use and find our way on the internet and that the internet and symbian and nokia does not only revolve around this little site ran by a bunch of nokia apologists, and read by a bunch of nokia employees. If you treat people like crap, then expect to be treated like crap.
Unregistered wrote:You're the 1 having a hard time comprehending anything here. Everyone knows you've been a Nokia user all your life coz you've been repeating it all the time like our grandmothers! In your crusade to put Nokia back on track, you are rude and you offend a lot of people, so COMPREHEND that first. And yes we know how to use and find our way on the internet and that the internet and symbian and nokia does not only revolve around this little site ran by a bunch of nokia apologists, and read by a bunch of nokia employees. If you treat people like crap, then expect to be treated like crap.
I don't have to comprehend anything from trolls on sites. Especially unregistered ones. Offending people? Give me a break. I never insulted anyone unless you consider terms like "fanboy" or "apologist" insulting. Where's your sense of humour? Why the sad face? Did I criticize your little platform too much? And no, I am not on a crusade to put Nokia back on track. I quite frankly don't care enough.
I will continue to express my opinion whether you like it or not. I thought that's what forums such as these were for. I'm not asking anyone to agree with me.
So I will continue to post here until the AAS owners feel that people like me don't belong here and they'd rather it be one big Nokia love fest.
Arthur wrote:Therefore I presented to you Scott Weiss, one of the top managers at Symbian who also thinks S60 sucks. There are many other voices in the industry that say it sucks. Or will you in your ignorance bash the Symbian manager too?
Except he doesn't actually say that, does he Arthur? I think most people would agree the UI needs revamped for S60v5 just as Mr Weiss does. That's not the same as saying it 'sucks'.
I think we're done here, aren't we?
Most likely we reading the thread on this geek-oriented (and very interesting!) website, like the S60 and/or S80 user interface, but the truth is that both the interfaces are very bad by modern standards. Just try to do the following simple experiment: find somebody in your family, not a phone geek, even better born before 1955, and convince him to use one of the Nokia smartphones.
In my experience it is hopeless, in particular if you face an old school engineer 😊 To most of the natural questions, like "could I synchronize my old phone and new phone directly, without using a computer?", "is it advisable to synchronize contacts with ovi?", "this phone plays movies; how can I add a movie myself?", "could I copy and paste between applications" the most obvious answer is "it almost works, but... better do not try it" (because your contacts may be lost for good) or "additional software would be required" (to convert the video 😊).
I wonder when they learn at Nokia that most people want all the smartphone functions working properly out of the box, without any tweaking and maintenance. Yes, there is a progress, for examples ovi e-mail is much better then the original e-mail client, but please, face the reality, people want ONE program to perform a given task, that is one good browser, with a reasonable password manager and copy&paste enabled, one editor capable of editing moderatly complicated .rtf and .doc files and so on.
I would forget the last but not the least complain. Why do you not support your older S60 devices? Apple can do this, actually they support their hardware from the year 1999 and perhaps even some older devices, why you cannot grasp the simple truth that this is the way to show respect to your customers?
Arthur wrote:I don't have to comprehend anything from trolls on sites. Especially unregistered ones. Offending people? Give me a break. I never insulted anyone unless you consider terms like "fanboy" or "apologist" insulting. Where's your sense of humour? Why the sad face? Did I criticize your little platform too much? And no, I am not on a crusade to put Nokia back on track. I quite frankly don't care enough.I will continue to express my opinion whether you like it or not. I thought that's what forums such as these were for. I'm not asking anyone to agree with me.
So I will continue to post here until the AAS owners feel that people like me don't belong here and they'd rather it be one big Nokia love fest.
Ok Apple fanboy, I'm game😊..
Arthur wrote:Let me explain, hopefully it won't be too hard for you to comprehend.I have been purchasing and using Nokia Symbian phones for a long time. It is my right to express my opinion on this forum and elsewhere. Just as it is to express yours. Now, it is my opinion that S60 touch sucks and sucks balls big time. Get it?
You might ask: "who cares what Arthur thinks". And you're right.
Therefore I presented to you Scott Weiss, one of the top managers at Symbian who also thinks S60 sucks. There are many other voices in the industry that say it sucks. Or will you in your ignorance bash the Symbian manager too?
There are people in every industry that say that everything sucks.
I didn't object to your right to express whatever opinion you want, I merely asked what motivates you to do it. You still didn't answer that question so what's to comprehend?
Your Scott Weiss idea waw more than answered. You read more into it than he said.
And what exactly is the difference between posting as 'unregistered' and some made up user name? Biggest cheap kop-out on the internet is: "you're anonymous so your opinion doesn't matter", which translates to: "I've got nothing better to throw back".
Unregistered wrote:I would forget the last but not the least complain. Why do you not support your older S60 devices? Apple can do this, actually they support their hardware from the year 1999 and perhaps even some older devices, why you cannot grasp the simple truth that this is the way to show respect to your customers?
Perhaps some companies could show respect by not restricting them to a single network vendor, ripping them off with extortionate contract charges, and trusting them to replace their own batteries.
A lot of the critisisms you poked at Nokia are equally applicable to other phone makers. What phone plays every video format?
[quote]I agree not now, but Nokia makes phones, it will move where the market is. Compaq and IBM moved from MS-DOS to Windows when the market demanded it.
They did. Which is only to be expected as the Operating System vendor (Microsoft) released the lastest version of their OS, so the hardware makers adopted is.
[/quote]
In which case why didn't the market move to Windows in 1986, a year after Microsoft released it? Or 1988? By the early 1990s the market demanded a GUI, Microsoft provided it. Supply doesn't magically create demand.
If the market wants Android, Nokia will supply Android phones.
Symbian/S60 really is the most solid, proven, reliable mobile OS by a LONG way in existence today
In 1930, steam was the most solid, proven and reliable locomotive fuel. And the cheapest.
Electricity: it'll never catch on.
Unregistered wrote:In 1930, steam was the most solid, proven and reliable locomotive fuel. And the cheapest.
No, steam is not a fuel. Wood or coal is a fuel or steam locomotives. Steam is the means of transducing the energy from the fuel and into motion.
Equally, S60 is not an OS. S60 will be redeveloped and updated, but Symbian will still be underneath it because it is the best OS for mobiles. There is no need fo Nokia to change to any of the older linux/unix based OSs that have been adapted to small devices when they have a younger and better underlying OS that was design from the start for small devices. It would be like going from steam back to horses.
Unregistered wrote:In 1930, steam was the most solid, proven and reliable locomotive fuel. And the cheapest.Electricity: it'll never catch on.
Ps. almost all electricty plants, excluding hydro plants, use steam to drive turbines.
Unregistered wrote:If you want. but I would consider the true touch era started when Apple made it mass market.God, I hate to give Apple credit, I have an issue with them because of the way iTunes locks you in to their products and would therefore not buy anything of theirs. They are innovative though..
I wouldn't disagree. I was just making the point that Symbian has had a touch interphase designed into it for a long time and it is not something that has been stuck on.
The problem is that people look at S60 and think that is Symbian. It isn't, it is just an interphase. You could argue the true Symbian line went Psion Series 5 | Ericsson R380 | Sony Ericsson P800 | Sony Ericsson P900 | Sony Ericsson P910 | Sony Ericsson P990 | Sony Ericsson P1 - after the Series 5 all of them Symbian touch phones! Unfortunately SE rather screwed up at that point but come the Autumn who knows?
So yes, S60 5th Edition might have been a rush job but that reflects purely on S60 5th Edition, not on the underlying Symbian OS.
Basically, Arthur is one of those argumentative types, who have nothing useful to say, and just like to stir up trouble.
People say they like the N97, they're either fanboys or Nokia employees. Anyone says anything he doesn't like, they're stupid. AAS is out of touch for not posting Internet rumours of a maemo phone as fact.
As far as I can tell, he's registered here simply to criticise AAS and its readers, as he has nothing useful to say. He may be a registered user, but he's still technically a troll.
Unregistered wrote: There is no need fo Nokia to change to any of the older linux/unix based OSs that have been adapted to small devices when they have a younger and better underlying OS that was design from the start for small devices. It would be like going from steam back to horses.
Hmm. So why are they going to migrate to Linux phones, based on Maemo, for the high end?
It's not a rumour, it's a fact. I've played with such a device.
SF will move towards mid tier in Nokia land
But what happens when Android also moves in that direction? How many SF manufacturers will want to continue with Symbian when Nokiahave always been producing better/cheaper Symbian devices than they can. Symbian's worst enemy has in fact been Nokia because other licensees never manged to make decent returns on their investments by and large. That includes Samsung who may well drop Symbian if their next couple of handsets don't sell well.
I have made a decent living out of Symbian in this industry but I don't think the wind is blowing in Symbian's favour to be honest.
I hope I'm wrong but I don't think I am.
Unregistered wrote:S60 will be redeveloped and updated, but Symbian will still be underneath it because it is the best OS for mobiles. There is no need fo Nokia to change to any of the older linux/unix based OSs that have been adapted to small devices when they have a younger and better underlying OS that was design from the start for small devices.
Interesting that people call Android immature and then say Symbian is younger !
Nokia has lost a lot of smartphone market share to RIM and Apple. They are better at reaching the market Nokia wants, because they make more attractive products. People buy products, and do not check the age of the OS (or even know or care about the OS is) when making a purchasing decision.
It would be like going from steam back to horses.
Do you think they put loyalty to an OS above their shareholders?
Nokia will use whatever it takes to make its products attractive again. If that means moving off Symbian in the long run, they will do so.
Unregistered wrote:Interesting that people call Android immature and then say Symbian is younger !
Because Android is based on a Linux kernel and Linux is 1991, Android as a phone OS is immature. Symbian is based on EPOC32 whiich is 1996/97. S60 is a layer on top of Symbian.
Unregistered wrote:Hmm. So why are they going to migrate to Linux phones, based on Maemo, for the high end?
It's not a rumour, it's a fact. I've played with such a device.
You shouldn't be talking about that if it is what I am thinking of.
But there is a difference between connected tablets (which the iPhone is) and more portable devices, yes. Maemo needs more costly hardware than Symbian (as does iHPne and Andorid.).