tym79m wrote:It is version 3.0, but it does indeed have free navigation. The "share your location" stuff isn't there (as far as I can tell) but free turn-by-turn definitely is.
Nope....only version 3.03 has free navigation, the earlier version before that i.e. 3.01 still requires licenses to be purchased.
KPOM wrote:The bottom line is that MMS is well behind SMS in terms of popularity. That Nokia themselves released the first Maemo phone without MMS is evidence enough that it is not a critical feature.
I've owned six Nokia devices, including 5 S60 devices over the past 3 years. If Nokia had released this 2 months ago I might have bit the bullet and kept my N97 a little longer. I like many aspects of Nokia phones and think today's move was a good one, albeit somewhat predictable after Google's move in November.
Haha. You own N900, right? No MMS there? So we do not need it? Get real. MMS is very nice feature. And is being used too. :tongue: Sorry for OT. Your N900 does not have this free Nav too. 😮
RogerPodacter wrote:i just dont believe that nobody uses MMS. my family uses it. my dad loves sending pics of the little kids and whatnot. friends of mine use it. i use it. i think there are a lot more people in the world using MMS than people let on around here.
I agree. I have many friends who use it. My whole family uses it across different countries to each other and friends. We love our MMS.
Unregistered wrote:Than the stats that the networks generate let on? There are far more pictures being bounced around as email attachments, or being pushed to sharing sites than MMS. MMS use is low and declining.But there's always one.
where are your stats from? in europe/asia, MMS is widely used.
KPOM wrote:Perhaps the fact that neither of us could find recent MMS articles even though SMS usage articles abound is telling.
Utter untruth - I specifically said that the article I found was simply posted because it was the FIRST I readily found in the Google results.
Please DO NOT twist my words in a way that is not true - I specifically already pointed out it was merely the FIRST I found!
If you want other data, how about the fact that in the US of A, an actual poor market for MMS, where it is not particularly popular yet, nevertheless, 10.3 BILLION, (yes billion) MMS messages were sent in the first half of 2009 alone...?
See:
You might even want to READ the rest of the .pdf itself "The Dimensions and Implications of SURGING MMS Growth" *lol*
KPOM wrote:Anyway, I did find this article from December 2008:http://techcrunchies.com/revenue-growth-of-mms-versus-sms/
The bottom line is that MMS is well behind SMS in terms of popularity.
Bottom line MY BOTTOM. That last statement is a disgrace. That is NOT the bottom line to this debate at all, and you know it. The debate is that MMS is allegedly "hardly used", as well as "not wanted". Those are indeed even the specific words I quoted in my original reply.
So you can't go around making up whatever you want as the "bottom line". The bottom line is merely whatever engendered debate in the first place, so let me remind you again, it was that it was claimed "MMS is hardly used", and that "MMS is not wanted". THAT my friend, is the bottom line - and what got ME into the debate, and what I responded to!
MMS is behind SMS in popularity...? Which genius did you need to ring to work that one out...? Firstly, they cost a lot more. Secondly most networks don't include MMS in "user allowance bundles" as they do SMS, thirdly they take longer to compose and send, fourth they are not even designed as a speedy method of back and forth communication, they are often a one way delivery mechanism, and fifth, I ALREADY said for myself in my last post, that MMS has nothing like the usage figures of SMS anyway - go look.
So why are you even repeating, something I already said for myself?
The point raised was that 1.5 MILLION every single DAY are being sent (very low Sept 2008 figures at that), for the UK alone.
How that compares pro-rata (I even used those words in my last post, highlighting this irrelevance) with SMS usage is neither here or there, given that the argument was never about MMS being on a par with SMS. As stated, the argument was specifically that MMS were allegedly "hardly used" and "not really wanted".
And 1.5 MILLION, every single day (that's 46.5 million a month, or over HALF A BILLION a year), hardly equates to "hardly used", or "not really wanted" now does it?
But that would be my THIRD time of asking that, and the point being conveniently ignored, wouldn't it???
KPOM wrote:That Nokia themselves released the first Maemo phone without MMS is evidence enough that it is not a critical feature.
And there's the EDUCATED, INFORMED mobile phone community thinking it was instead because MMS has not been a feature of the Meamo platform, which is what Nokia adopted for this phone, and like many other things missing from the N900, Nokia are having to "back-port" applications and services for Maemo over time, that it does not normally natively support, but previous Nokia users used to a Symbian Platform would expect from the device. MMS of course being most notable, because Maemo was not off the shelf, a PHONE platform or OS. And the timescales being what the are, because of Nokia's desire to get this out quick, as well as being genuinely surprised by the interest and uptake of the N900 device. But hey, what do we all know - I'm merely quoting all the tech journals, nokia blogs, and main news sources here, so they could of course ALL be way wrong, and it could as you say, be because Nokia don't see a future for MMS... Ha - PML here... quality!
KPOM wrote:I've owned six Nokia devices, including 5 S60 devices over the past 3 years. If Nokia had released this 2 months ago I might have bit the bullet and kept my N97 a little longer. I like many aspects of Nokia phones and think today's move was a good one, albeit somewhat predictable after Google's move in November.
Does anyone even know WHEN the actual DECISION was taken at senior level in Nokia, to make this free. As I am tired of hearing that "Google made this happen". How do WE know that...? How do we not know if this was something Nokia had decided to do back in September, with a view to launching it for all in Summer 2010 with big parties, major PR events and all sorts of other things planned, and the thing holding it up, was wanting to get all the Facebook integration, potential Twitter support, and who knows what else, tied up, and merely had to bring it forward because Google announced this first...? Speculation, for sure, but that's my point... as we will NEVER know, it means no one can realistically say "Google made this happen". As Google's offering is Sat-nav only, unlike Nokia's Facebook and Life-blogging add-ins, Nokia had other things to work through too, so it's hardly unreasonable to think this might have been Nokia's very idea and intent, long before Google announced their plans. Mmmmm...
KPOM wrote:To the original point, though, Apple managed to sell about 20 million iPhones before MMS became available. It went from 0 to #3 globally in about 2 years in terms of smartphone market share, without supporting MMS.
No, ONCE AGAIN, as you keep missing it, ney, actually out and out blatantly and deliberately IGNORING it - the original point was "mms is hardly used" and "mms is not wanted". How many times do I need to keep reminding you of that?
So what Apple did is not only irrelevant, it's actually potential ammunition for me, not you. As I know of at least five people who never got the original, or even later iPhones, specifically BECAUSE of it not supporting MMS. The very same reason two of them now, have held of getting the Nokia N900 until it has MMS added.
So your point is counter-productive. As all it does is beggar the response, "if Apple sold 20 million iPhones before they supported MMS, HOW MANY COULD THEY HAVE SOLD FROM THE OFF IF IT did SUPPORT MMS FROM THE OUTSET?".
That is all such a statement engenders.
So listen - to close, I will play verbal fencing with you all night and morning (it's 5:20am now), if you insist on bringing up irrelevant, unrelated new points, without first covering the original point at all.
But just to be clear yet again, my purpose in responding the very first time, was in relation to posts claiming "mms is hardly used" and "mms is not wanted".
And my response was simple enough... How does 1.5 million, every single day, in the UK alone, and using very low Sept 2008 figures at that, remotely equate to "hardly used" and "not wanted"?
So, I say to yet again - would you care to answer that, or do you want to bring up new things instead all morning long...?
Unregistered wrote:where are your stats from? in europe/asia, MMS is widely used.
Ignore the poster you aim that at mate - I suspect he is trolling.
In any event, I've just pointed out to him that even for America, 10.3 BILLION MMS messages were sent in the first half of 2009 alone.
So how anyone can try and say MMS is not used, or MMS is not wanted, is an utter joke *lol*
I agree with you mate.
Compass dissapeared in my E-72 after update. Direction can be changed manually using key 4 and 6.
GerWol wrote:On my e52 the compass no longer seems to work:frown:. Anyone else noticed something similar?
The compass no longer works on my E72 either. I'm tempted to uninstall it. Can't Nokia get anything right?!
KPOM wrote:Apparently, Apple does own a small map company, Placebase.http://www.pcworld.com/article/187402/nokia_voice_nav_spells_doom_for_tomtom_garmin.html
Perhaps they are just looking to replace the basic Google Maps already on iPhones, but perhaps they could add navigation, as well.
Placebase are not really a mapping company as TeleAtlas and Navteq are. It's very well known that there are only two 'proper' mapping companies (that actually own enough data to function alone) in the world. Apple would still be haemorrhaging cash like nothing normal if they too tried to go free.
Having said that, who knows what they'll do in future in terms of acquisitions and so on. I'm just saying they aren't in the same position as the other two.
Unregistered wrote:The compass no longer works on my E72 either. I'm tempted to uninstall it. Can't Nokia get anything right?!
random why they done this and dont seem to tell you anywhere obvious (it probably says about it in the support, but bein male i didn't look there... i found out the old fashioned way, try all the buttons out to see what they do
Yes, key 5 is the solution. Press key 9 for instructions. Please, see link below:
http://discussions.europe.nokia.com/discussions/board/message?board.id=communicators&thread.id=58468
I've disabled the MMS on my phone because I was getting 2 or 3 stupid adverts per day which I was having to delete. I believe this is what makes up the bulk of MMS traffic. I would be hard pushed to find someone who had a phone with email capability willing to send a tiny little image.
I just installed it on my N86 and it works very well, the compass rotation is realy smooth compared to 3.1 😊
Installs and works fine on my Nokia N97.
Brendan Donegan wrote:Placebase are not really a mapping company as TeleAtlas and Navteq are. It's very well known that there are only two 'proper' mapping companies (that actually own enough data to function alone) in the world. Apple would still be haemorrhaging cash like nothing normal if they too tried to go free.Having said that, who knows what they'll do in future in terms of acquisitions and so on. I'm just saying they aren't in the same position as the other two.
True. Google is attempting to build their own database, which is why their free maps are more limited. Apple and Google are increasingly competitive, so I doubt Apple would go to Google. However, TeleAtlas might be willing to deal, particularly if they are concerned that Nokia/Navteq might be trying to build a monopoly. It doesn't even require Apple purchasing TeleAtlas. Apple could strike a deal for TeleAtlas to be the exclusive provider of data, and then late Placebase write a navigation app.
My main point is that Apple can certainly find a way to offer navigation if it feels the need to. Nokia's purchase of Navteq certainly hinted at a convergence of mobile and GPS devices. With Google and now Nokia firmly in the "free navigation" camp, it could put pressure on Apple to do the same.
i slept now a night after nokia gave us free navigation..
And the more i think about it the less i like it. Especially nokia that already has the behavior we drop phones as fast as possible because we want you to buy new phones
the last phones i had i all had more or about 2 years (9300, E90) and there getting new firmware updates with more features was not really done.
My hope was that with the N900 because maemo is way more open that behavior of nokia was not moved to the N900 (if it is this will be my last nokia phone).
But now i think it will happen because of this free navigation.. Because where does nokia now get its profit from??? Yes selling new phones.. So what should nokia do to get people do that? Yes stop supporting phones as soon as possible no more upgrades no more new features. Nothing.. Because if you want that buy a new phone.
I hate that business i really dont like it. That i find a big plus for Apple, apple doesnt do much right in my eyes but that is a big plus.. Also android especially if you have a rooted device is also upgradeable.
Why cant i just have an option that i pay for the hardware and for the software including the OS and all the build in apps. I really want to pay for that yearly if needed. (let say i pay nokia 50 euro's per year to get all the latest upgrades until really my hardware cant handled it anymore)
Because if i pay nokia i can expect and sort of "demand" that nokia does give me the things. But now also with maps. Where is nokia's drive to upgrade and support older phones ?? Its completely gone.
jcompagner wrote:
But now i think it will happen because of this free navigation.. Because where does nokia now get its profit from??? Yes selling new phones.. So what should nokia do to get people do that? Yes stop supporting phones as soon as possible no more upgrades no more new features. Nothing.. Because if you want that buy a new phone.I hate that business i really dont like it. That i find a big plus for Apple, apple doesnt do much right in my eyes but that is a big plus.. Also android especially if you have a rooted device is also upgradeable.
Why cant i just have an option that i pay for the hardware and for the software including the OS and all the build in apps. I really want to pay for that yearly if needed. (let say i pay nokia 50 euro's per year to get all the latest upgrades until really my hardware cant handled it anymore)
Because if i pay nokia i can expect and sort of "demand" that nokia does give me the things. But now also with maps. Where is nokia's drive to upgrade and support older phones ?? Its completely gone.
The rumor is that iPhone OS 4.0 will support only the new iPhone and possibly the 3G and 3GS models (IOW the original iPhone will no longer be supported). That still means that it was "current" for over 2.5 years, though. Android device makers need to be quicker at adopting the latest OS and making their phones upgradable. Motorola is still releasing new phones using the 1.6 OS, for instance, while 2.X is the most current. This will be something Google needs to tackle, and I suspect Nexus One was part of that (i.e. it is intended to be a benchmark).
That said, Nokia does seem more wedded to the hardware sales model than before. Ovi was supposed to be about software/service revenue, but now they are giving away a major part of it for free. They'll need to make up the revenue somewhere.
You do know that Google Maps for Mobile *already* offers navigation for free, right?
From the article, it looks like you've never used Google Maps for Mobile.
Nokia's move is an attempt to keep their pace. Google's move to offer free, turn-by-turn navigation was the real industry-shifting move.
shadamehr wrote:Utter untruth - I specifically said that the article I found was simply posted because it was the FIRST I readily found in the Google results.Please DO NOT twist my words in a way that is not true - I specifically already pointed out it was merely the FIRST I found!
<snip>
Mate, you're the only one that is talking sense here. You're utterly right. How anyone could dismiss MMS I don't know... actually I do know. A person who is bemoaning the lack of MMS on his/her own current or past phone so has to slag it off in order to make themselves feel better.
Fact is, MMS is used and is far far more useful than e-mail when used on a phone. In fact, having MMS and e-mail means that people have TWO methods to send pictures, video, sound, etc. to people. Much better than having one method (e-mail) that doesn't send directly to someone's phone.
I had only just signed up for a 1year subscription to nav in November for my 5800, so on 1 hand I'm happy that it will be free from now on and on the other hand pretty gutted that i just blew $110 AUD for a product that is now free for all to use!!!
Wonder if Nokia would care to start refunding any recent subscribers???
Unregistered wrote:You do know that Google Maps for Mobile *already* offers navigation for free, right?
From the article, it looks like you've never used Google Maps for Mobile.
Nokia's move is an attempt to keep their pace. Google's move to offer free, turn-by-turn navigation was the real industry-shifting move.
This has been discussed. Old news, and no use to me. No google maps naviagation available for my country and anyway their online maps are a pain in the butt.
MMS is really for advertising, I think most people don't bother with it. A few kids etc. I've asked around the office and found some people that have tried it, but nobody is a regular user. Most have never used it.
This is the last time that I will find my way to the end of this enormous thread.
Unregistered wrote:This has been discussed. Old news, and no use to me. No google maps naviagation available for my country and anyway their online maps are a pain in the butt.MMS is really for advertising, I think most people don't bother with it. A few kids etc. I've asked around the office and found some people that have tried it, but nobody is a regular user. Most have never used it.
This is the last time that I will find my way to the end of this enormous thread.
there were multiple links posted that prove you wrong, so let's just let it go.
anyway, i bet nokia will make up for this lost revenue by possibly including an extra 10 dollar fee into every new handset sold or something. the consumer probably wouldnt even notice, and nokia would make some navigation money at the same time.
It can already be installed & run on the N97 without problem.
After install my C: was reduced by aprox 10MB
At the download page select and download the N97mini version to your computer then transfer it to your phone.
The only issue is that you must a)log in to ovi b) in settings-navigation download a walking-guide voice
before you hit the walk icon, otherwise maps hangs - at least it did it for me three times
Once you got your walk-voice (swedish phone so uncertain of english name...) your fine and it works like a charm!
Unregistered wrote:The compass no longer works on my E72 either. I'm tempted to uninstall it. Can't Nokia get anything right?!
Just press 5. Your compass will magically appear😊 You have to use keyboard shortcuts to activate various features.
Not free for us Canadians...
Unregistered wrote:I've disabled the MMS on my phone because I was getting 2 or 3 stupid adverts per day which I was having to delete. I believe this is what makes up the bulk of MMS traffic. I would be hard pushed to find someone who had a phone with email capability willing to send a tiny little image.
Wouldn't it have been far more SENSIBLE for you, just to go into the Settings/MMS Options screen, and "Disable Anonymous Adverts".
Or were you not even aware that n the settings, you have lots of control over what TYPES of MMS can be received...
Mmmmmmmmm.
And not sure where you are located in the world, but I've not yet had an anonymous advert MMS sent to me EVER, in all the time I have had MMS capabilities (back when we girst got GPRS, some five or six years ago, or even more), and that's WITHOUT having the option to get them even being turned off in my phone!
So instead of ranting at MMS, a tool which I (and millions of other people) use to brighten the lives of my friends and family up with daily, you'd be better off either putting your settings right, or ranting at your government to get them to introduce some effective legislation to prevent the 'spam' you claim you are getting mate!
testman wrote:Mate, you're the only one that is talking sense here. You're utterly right. How anyone could dismiss MMS I don't know... actually I do know. A person who is bemoaning the lack of MMS on his/her own current or past phone so has to slag it off in order to make themselves feel better.Fact is, MMS is used and is far far more useful than e-mail when used on a phone. In fact, having MMS and e-mail means that people have TWO methods to send pictures, video, sound, etc. to people. Much better than having one method (e-mail) that doesn't send directly to someone's phone.
Thanks for the sensible words testman mate - Amazing isn't it, how a thread meant to be about Ovi maps, instead, funnily sees so many people instead talking about how MMS is supposedly not wanted used, or needed.
I've just had to respond to yet another.
And despite me having at least FIVE rebuttals and clarifications in this thread now, including pointing out that the UK sent 1.5 MILLION MMS every single day, and that was even way back in Sept 2008, and also how the USA sent 10.3 BILLION MMS in the first half of 2009 alone, we still get the iPhone fanbois and Nokia-haters coming out with moronic statements about how MMS is not wanted, used, or needed by anyone.
How retarded do they want to make themselves keep looking...?
FIVE response posts from me, and yet not one single post from them disputing or dispelling any of my facts.
DOH.
Must be soooo frustrating, not having had MMS on your iPlod, sorry iPhone from the outset.
Which brings me on to my next burning issue I've ALREADY also mentioned in here folks...
The N900/Maemo owners/issues...
Nokia DO NOT "not love you lot"...
Nokia have NOT forgotten about you...
Nokia DO NOT beleive MMS has no future.
For the however many-eth time, LISTEN, and LISTEN good you maemo owners, as I am starting to get sick of saying this...
Maemo was an OS Nokia thought they would experiment with, and thus saw fit to grace us with the N900.
HOWEVER, the interest, and indeed demand for this device, far surpassed Nokia's expectations... That's what often happens with a new 'test' device, and OS.
Furthermore, and the bit you should listen up about... Maemo, as it came, off-the-shelf, was NOT specifically designed for Mobile Telephony at it's core.
Instead Nokia took an OS with a powerful media/web/UI heart, and 'added' telephony style to it.
Nokia have already readily accepted that by going down the maemo route, as it stood at the time, it meant that they would have to 'back-port' many applications and features users have come to expect of Symbian based Nokia handsets, over to the Maemo platform that off the shelf, did not ever even have such features.
MMS is one such classic example.
So I can't tell you for sure that Nokia will be soon giving you this with the N900 (though I would strongly suspect so).
But I can tell you that MMS not being in the N900 is not for one second due to any policy decision from Nokia that it is not wanted, needed or used (if that were the truth, we'd start to see it dropped from our current Symbian devices as well).
And I can also say that it doesn't mean that Nokia don't love you N900 users either.
It MERELY means that Maemo, as on the N900, did not have certain features already in it, that Symbian/previous Nokia device users, have come to take for granted etc.
And as such, Nokia will need to CREATE these missing apps, to make Maemo comparable with existing telephony features of Symbian Nokias.
That's all it means folks, so please stop claiming any different.
What is it with this whole thread, that has so many nay-sayers, rubbish-sprouters, and doom-mongers in it *lol*
Cheers all, and have a great day/night/sleep wherever in the world and thus time, this post finds you all.
me, I'm off to bed, as it's 01:05am here in the UK.
Unregistered wrote: snipped...MMS is really for advertising, I think most people don't bother with it. A few kids etc. I've asked around the office and found some people that have tried it, but nobody is a regular user. Most have never used it.
This is the last time that I will find my way to the end of this enormous thread.
You even actually READING the posts in this thread..?
I've already said multiple times, that MMS is being WELL used in most markets.
Way back as far as Sept 2008, 1.5 MILLION every single DAY were being sent in the UK ALONE.
Indeed, in just the first half of 2009 alone, 10.3 BILLION (yes billion) MMS were sent in the USA.
I, here in the UK, use it pretty much daily, as do most other people I know, now that MMS is included in most people's allowance bundles these days, depending on who your carrier is, and what tariff you are on.
So the fact that you, in your part of the world, if it's somewhere else, hardly use it, or move in such social circles that you also don't know anyone else that uses it, nevertheless, has no bearing on what the world itself is doing.
And as I say, given just an example of figures stated, in the rest of the world, MASSIVE, MASSIVE MILLIONS AND BILLIONS of MMS are being sent.
FACT. PERIOD.
Actually stating real world figures for actual numbers of MMS sent, is without doubt, far more realistic a measure, than the anecdotal "I don't use it, and nor do my mates".
So please, if you don't use it, good for you... and even your mates too, if they don't either.
Me, I was just telling you what's happening in the real world, right across the world, and offering REAL figures as factual evidence to support it, too.
*lol*
Would Nokia have shipped the N900 without the ability to make a call? What about the ability to send an SMS? They managed to port or write e-mail, basic navigation, music playing, contact management, and calendar applications, but not MMS. Apparently they think they can sell the phone in the meantime without MMS but with those features.
Unregistered wrote:You do know that Google Maps for Mobile *already* offers navigation for free, right?
From the article, it looks like you've never used Google Maps for Mobile.
Nokia's move is an attempt to keep their pace. Google's move to offer free, turn-by-turn navigation was the real industry-shifting move.
Read the comparison, it is not the same. From your comment, you must not have used any other navigation device other than google. That and you must live in north america.