The Nokia N97 - Polarising opinion still

Marmite? At that price more like caviar.....

I am not normally rude but the bloke in the glasses is a complete d**k

I have never known any problems with using the 5800 resistive touchscreen, it is the best resistive screen I have used. Most reports say the N97 is better than that.

I would put money on that bloke having an iPhone in his pocket.

@Yade,

I know *many* people (personally) who say the 5800's touchscreen is poor, not to mention the large amount complaining on the internet as well.

Saying that the 5800's is the best resistive touchscreen you've ever had is a bit like saying "Syphilis is the best STD I've ever had" - it's still bad.

And yes, he does have an iPhone in his pocket. That's the perfect example of how a touchscreen should feel and behave.

There is no doubt that N97 has evoked strong emotions. Both positive and negative. The question is how it is going to affect its sales.

I think it'll bust.

This confirms what I feared. Symbian by default is very difficult to set up if you've never used it before. Moreover, this 5th edition , at the core, is the same as the previous versions of non touch UI: menus, in sub menus and other menus. Don't get me wrong, I prefer Symbian to WM, I have both an E90 and E70, but the N97 has not yet reached maturity. For a price like that you expect it to perform. It is 750 euros where I live and when you shell out that much you want something stellar. Nokia has missed it, again like with the N95 8GB. I hope they are not too late to the party when they decide to drop Symbian for their touch UI.

Ohhh, nice. Where was the Steve Balmer with WinMo? He was missing in this funny fight. Every system has its own. Iphone is for fun and N97 is for bussines. Why everyone needs a perfect device that is absolute ideal. This fights are needless. These devices are designed for different markets. Iphone is an amazing device for gaming, watching videos and surfing on the web, but at this point all good is ending for iphone. And N97 is a all-in-one device. It can be used for more than iphone, but with resistive display and not fully optimized operating system for touches (native) it is only like substitution. But I think that N97 is a total winner in this battle, because iphone is only a children game.

JKA

...they're both right.

The principle here is called appropriation: the emphasis on the tools one uses to construct one's social reality.

What exactly is wrong with the 5800 or resistive touch screens? You touch it, and it detects your touch and responds. It can even do handwriting recognition with a stylus. It's damn good on the 5800, but there will always be dimwits who can't cope. Unfortunately the 5800 touch screen has not yet been optimized sufficiently to turn water into wine, but possibly by the next firmware update that feature will be included.

The guy with with the glasses, what a complete and utter numptie !!

Closet Apple Fanboy I think !

Mr Mark wrote:...they're both right.

The principle here is called appropriation: the emphasis on the tools one uses to construct one's social reality.

I so hope you are being sarcastic. No normal human would talk like that.

@E90
The problem isn't with the underlying Symbian operating system, the problem is with Nokia-owned S60 UI.

Do you think that swapping Symbian out for another OS is going to solve Nokia's UI problems? You'll still have the same people designing the UI!

Unregistered wrote:What exactly is wrong with the 5800 or resistive touch screens? .....
Unfortunately the 5800 touch screen has not yet been optimized sufficiently to turn water into wine, but possibly by the next firmware update that feature will be included.

Neither has the 5800 touch screen been optimised to implement multitouch resembling features.

Who cares about the dickhead..look at the girl..what a babe..if she's selling the N97, I'm buying😉

Arcade wrote:Neither has the 5800 touch screen been optimised to implement multitouch resembling features.

Oh dear. My heart is broken, I don't know if I will be able to go on now, having learned that news, but I'll try. It is devestating to suddenly discover that my phone is utterly unusable.

Jeez what a bunch of anals. So, no multi-touch; what do I need to do that I can't do because of that? In fact why the hell do I want to stand like a geek and operate my phone with two hands when just a single thumb is sufficient?

However did you people survive all those years without multi-touch? Another solution without a problem that makes the phone operation worse. Talk about emperors new clothes.

Unregistered wrote:@E90
The problem isn't with the underlying Symbian operating system, the problem is with Nokia-owned S60 UI.

Do you think that swapping Symbian out for another OS is going to solve Nokia's UI problems? You'll still have the same people designing the UI!

I agree with you. The Nokia folks seem to have their "own" approach to touch UI. Could it be because of all those Apple, HTC, etc patents? In any case, you must agree that the N97 does not live up to the hype 😞. At one point, on the engadget website, someone rang, and the N97 user could not pick up 😮. Kept tapping every button and the phone call was not answered. This, to me, is a major issue.

Steve, Rafe,

Could you guys confirm that it was one in a million? I mean, does the hardware lock, take over the software lock? By this, I mean if you lock it from the button and you tap the screen to pick up, will the screen unlock?

Cheers,

Wish ...

The N97 is a colossal failure, period. The only hope that Nokia has will be with Maemo powered devices (tablets with telephony built in). The upcoming N900 looks promising.

And please stop calling people who don't like the N97 Apple fan boys. I don't own any Apple prodcts nor am I interested in them. At the same time the truth must be told. The N97 is, in the words of a Nokia employee that I quote: "steaming pile of s**t".

There is polarizing opinion because there are Nokia loyalists and open-minded folk. The latter expect a lot more from Nokia's flagship (especially at $700), two years on from the Apple iPhone; the former think it's a wonderful upgrade from the devices they already had. It may indeed be a huge step forward for Nokia devices, but to the open-minded folk, it smacks of Espoo sticking their heads in the sand, instead of giving a revolutionary new device that finally gets Nokia back into the fight for the high-end smartphone.

As an ex-Windows, ex-Nokia loyalist, I have to say, I agree with this quote from an ex-Apple executive: "Now just another user looking for the best system." And Nokia, so far, isn't it.

ArthurKnobhead wrote:The N97 is a colossal failure, period.

So you've used your crystal ball to see into the future at the sales figues then? What a fool.

For "open minded" folk, neither the N97 nor the Apple slabphone are the best phone. They are both inconveniently oversized and over priced pieces of overkill and no more than toys. I wouldn't waste good money on either when there is fun to be had.

i have been using Nokia phones for over 8 yrs and up until 5th edition, everything has been gravy. the main gripe i and most people have with 5th edition is not the OS itself but the UI. i for one totally HATE the counter intuitive scrolling in contacts or in lists, you drag your finger down to scroll up. i mean come on that makes absolutely no sense at all, yeah you can give me that bull that you get used to it but i for one can't. it just requires too much skill to get it to scroll properly so you don't pass what you looking for, try doing that when you in a hurry and see how frustrating it is. there is hope though as i just watched a video of the 5530 xpressmusic and Nokia changed the scrolling throughout the interface so you can now scroll up by dragging the list up and it is also kinetic, that alone would make me dump my 5800 for a 5530. yeah i don't really care about UMTS, i will rather keep my battery life. i have UMTS right now and unless there is some bug in my 5800 the battery life is terrible in UMTS mode and also it shows full bars even when there is no signal, weird.

also in the web browser, there is so much waste of screen space. when you start loading a page in landscape mode, the top fifth of the screen is occupied by status indicators and the right quarter by the menu icons which in my opinion are a little too big, in the N97 the screen goes full when the page loads but the 5800 does not. personally i do not think the menu buttons should be as large as they are in landscape, if they were reduced by a third their size i think it would be perfect. i would also prefer them at the bottom of the screen out of the way but i guess for accessibility they are better on the right. also the signal and battery indicators can be made horizontal instead of vertical to take less space.

another thing about the browser is that there must be some kind of bug slowing it down 'cos it is sloowww. it takes longer to load a page on the 5800 than on an ipod touch connected to the SAME 5800 through joikuspot. that is just weird. i am almost sure that the same thing will happen with the N97.

also i think they need to remove the arrow that allows you to get out of full screen and maybe use a long press on the screen to switch from full screen. if you ever browse a page with colours other than white, the white box that surrounds that arrow is not only really annoying but also distracting.

the keyboard here is a mixed bag, i mean i can see Nokia's reasoning on the space bar position and believe me it makes sense once you get to use it but what i hate is that the keys themselves are a tad small (i have big thumbs) and to make matters worse they have a mushy click instead of a definitive click. i think nokia went with this keyboard for aesthetics but personally i would have preferred usability, i mean like the HTC touch pro 2 keyboard. if you have ever used that keyboard you will know what am talking about.

also what happened to 'mark several'. i mean after the pencil key was removed from pretty much every recent nokia phone, i can only select one item at a time or select all. believe me this is extremely annoying and i get a huge migraine whenever i want to delete several songs or several messages from my phone without a computer (this is supposed to be a multimedia computer for Pete's sake!). i have to do three things just to select one item - options->mark/unmark->mark or mark several - and if there are several items i have to do that for each item or else just delete everything :grrrr:. come on nokia how about enabling a check box so i can select exactly what i want to delete or move or copy or whatever without spending the whole day trying to delete 37 messages.

don't get me wrong, i love nokia phones the hardware is nothing short of amazing and the OS is wonderful but when it comes to the UI...there is like a big disconnect. new users have a problem getting accustomed to it and most seasoned users are actually coping with it. trust me i have used almost every high tech s60 starting with the 6600 and the situation has been to cope with it or get third party software to alleviate the suffering.

also why exactly does this flagship device not have a graphics accelerator, please tell me why. the iphone 3Gs has a powervr or some other graphics chip and UI transitions are sweet and fast cos of it. the N97 promised us beautiful animations and transitions in the debut videos but so far i see dismal performance in that department, the transitions are either too slow or non existent. i was so looking forward to seeing the widgets swivel like in the flash videos they had but all i see is a black screen. i know a lot of people will say transitions are annoying or slow your device but i like them, it is a personal choice and if done right the device is just as fast with or without them. besides this is N-series, the device should be fun to use and transitions are fun.

by the way the only thing, the iphone brings to the table is UI ease of use, hardware wise i think they are just raping their customers. the ease of use is what makes it so attractive, i have tried using it and believe me its browser is the best out there and i am basing this on load speed, colour rendering and crispness alone 'cos s60 loses in navigation 'cos of the resistive screen. i find this weird though cos both browsers are based on webkit. even then i wouldn't buy an iphone 'cos of the way it is marketed, they make buyers look like idiots when they claim it is the most feature complete phone you will ever need.

What would an anthropologist make of this tribalism?

Steve will this substitute for my MX5 and is there a very simple language that I can write my own business costing programs on. SIMPLE like BASIC

I find it a sad indictment of the consumer society that so much importance is placed on the superficial pretty UI effects which costs in processor, hardware, programming effort and battery power for what is actually very little benefit. The modern consumer is just so pathetically shallow.

This whole dichotomy is bringing out the luddite in me. Show me a phone that is robust, has a decent camera, can make calls and doesn't cost much. There you will have the best phone. Screw all the geek stuff, the nurdy pie-phone users and sad slidey keyboard geeks.

Unregistered wrote:So you've used your crystal ball to see into the future at the sales figues then? What a fool.

For "open minded" folk, neither the N97 nor the Apple slabphone are the best phone. They are both inconveniently oversized and over priced pieces of overkill and no more than toys. I wouldn't waste good money on either when there is fun to be had.

You missed the point. I don't care how many units the N97 sells. Motorola RAZR sold in millions. It doesn't make it good. From a power user standpoint (and that's what AAS is or should be about) the N97 is a failure.

Gee? Poor screen reading in sunlight - TRY WHITE THEME WITH BLACK TEXT- Duh!

Arthur wrote:You missed the point. I don't care how many units the N97 sells. Motorola RAZR sold in millions. It doesn't make it good. From a power user standpoint (and that's what AAS is or should be about) the N97 is a failure.

Have you actually used one daily for a week? Didn't think so. 9 days in with it an have decided to sell the N-85, E-71, N 810, and the girlfriend gets the 5800.... that's my recomendation.

Arthur wrote:You missed the point. I don't care how many units the N97 sells. Motorola RAZR sold in millions. It doesn't make it good. From a power user standpoint (and that's what AAS is or should be about) the N97 is a failure.

And it doesn't make the N97 bad or a failure because "Arthur" doesn't like it.

Unregistered wrote:Have you actually used one daily for a week? Didn't think so. 9 days in with it an have decided to sell the N-85, E-71, N 810, and the girlfriend gets the 5800.... that's my recomendation.

You must be joking. Just wait till the novelty wears off. But good for you my friend. I guess those who criticize it are wrong then because you love it.

Just a quick one here.....have my nokia 97 now for a few days and I honestly have to stress and point out that it is an absolute pleasure to use the phone. Sure the UI could do with a bid of tweaking but overall whether resistive/captive it doesn't make a lot of difference, I have big hands and no prob touching the screen, it is fluent and easy to use. I also love the design (white) I think its a very elegant phone , despite the plastic albeit high grade.
The same with the keyboard after a while its so easy to use and again with my fat fingers i have no problem to type fast .sure the No row could have been better executed but touch-pad and space bar no problem ...easy whats the big deal. Lets not forget this phone is a work in progress on a very high level and it will get better and better . Where i would say it def needs to improve is on the camera , i think the pics are slightly less sharp then on the n95 but thats my personal opinion and we only talking about a slight difference...sure a future firmware will address it.
Again I would say in my own personal experience this is the best phone i ever have had and it feels great in the hand and cant keep my hands off..definitely worth the money

Unregistered wrote:I so hope you are being sarcastic. No normal human would talk like that.

Unregistered wrote:Just a quick one here.....have my nokia 97 now for a few days and I honestly have to stress and point out that it is an absolute pleasure to use the phone. Sure the UI could do with a bid of tweaking but overall whether resistive/captive it doesn't make a lot of difference, I have big hands and no prob touching the screen, it is fluent and easy to use. I also love the design (white) I think its a very elegant phone , despite the plastic albeit high grade.
The same with the keyboard after a while its so easy to use and again with my fat fingers i have no problem to type fast .sure the No row could have been better executed but touch-pad and space bar no problem ...easy whats the big deal. Lets not forget this phone is a work in progress on a very high level and it will get better and better . Where i would say it def needs to improve is on the camera , i think the pics are slightly less sharp then on the n95 but thats my personal opinion and we only talking about a slight difference...sure a future firmware will address it.
Again I would say in my own personal experience this is the best phone i ever have had and it feels great in the hand and cant keep my hands off..definitely worth the money

Are you a Nokia employee? You certainly sound like one.